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Originally Posted by filtherton
I think the idea is that science is limited, and that humanity's ability to understand the universe is limited. Is there a phenomena that science can't observe? How could you tell?
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Science is a method of investigation. Science doesn't observe things,
we do! If there is a phenomena that you can't observe, why do you think it ever happened? Do you see the madness in this proposition? This is what it is to be religious...
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I think he's saying that the methods by which scientists go about explaining reality don't jibe well with the methods that religious folk use to explain reality, and also perhaps that it is useless to attempt to use science to try to explain things which are by definition not verifiable by scientific means. I think he's saying that folks who try to explain away theism with science miss the point of theism.
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I could hardly make sense of most of this paragraph but I think I understand the last sentence. Let me say that those who think that explaining "away theism with science miss the point of theism" miss the point of science!
In other words (without a forced quotation), those who wonder why anyone would investigate theism scientifically miss the point of science!
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It is silly to lash out against all religion when your problems lie with a subset of religious folk. I cringe when some of my fellow atheists, the ones who would call themselves guardians of reason, can't be bothered to see the forest because of the trees that are in the way. The fact that certain fundamentalists feel threatened by science says nothing about religion in general. If one were so inclined as to take a casual survey of the facts, one might see that there are plenty of religious folk who also balk at the subversion of science, as well as plenty of people who, for completely secular reasons, would subvert science and reason as a convenient means to an end.
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I have spoken to a good number of christians and I have gained some sympathy for their plight. I regularly attend
Campus Crusade for Christ events, made easy by the fact that I live in a small town with two universities in it, one of which is rather prestigious. Life is hard and if a bunch of fairy tales helps you get through it, more power to you.
My problem with religion is when religious people start enforcing the principles of their fairy tales onto me. When they start influencing politics, en mass, on issues of what I may or may not wear, whom I may or may not marry, what I may or may not research, what we may or may not teach, etc... then fuck you and your religion! These people have political power and very few of them live with the idea that "well, they're my beliefs so I'm the only one who needs to follow them." Christians on this continent think that their religion constitutes
absolute morality and, thus, must enforce this onto everyone...
I only brought up science because that's what offends me the most. In rural America, anti-science fundamentalist christians are not a fringe minority. They make up more than 50% of the population and the rest of the theists don't appear to be standing up to their religious cousins. It really looks like religion is the problem and not just a couple of wackos...