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Originally Posted by n0nsensical
Society has extremely unrealistic expectations on children, and when they can't meet them, what do we do, break out the amphetamines and other powerful stimulants of course. The whole War on Drugs is predicated on the idea that we need to protect children from drug addiction. While we enthusiastically give them some of the most addictive drugs in existence. Well, yes, one of the effects of speed is to make you more focused. When it's in the service of society, it's fine; when it's in the service of your own enjoyment, it's somehow wrong and therefore illegal. The levels of hypocrisy we're willing to reach to justify certain ends are astounding.
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Well put. I agree with this sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Johnny Rotten
I think a lot of that has to do with how much time a medical practitioner can give or is willing to give to a patient or client. It's much more efficient and statistically effective (in the short term at least), for them to hand you a prescription and move on to the next person. We're dealing with the massive generation of aging baby boomers, and the population of doctors has not scaled to it.
That's not to excuse them offering pills the first time they see you. I think that's borderline irresponsible. You can't really get a complete picture of a person's mental health in one sitting, largely because the patient himself might not be aware of the depth or complexity of his condition. Or they may be understandably uncomfortable with disclosing every relevant detail to a person they've never met.
There's also the symptomatic approach to Western medicine that you mentioned. You can give a person Tylenol if they get headaches a lot, but you could also stop the headaches from recurring in the first place, if the problem is environmental or dietary.
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I'll clarify by saying that it wasn't on the first sitting in our case. We've been a few times, and had questionaires filled out by her teachers and by us. None-the-less I agree with your statements.
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Originally Posted by ChassisWelder
To go with your original post Herk, should it REALLY be up to children to make their own decisions regarding their health?
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Absolutely, as long as the benefit of waiting outweighs the risk. In this case, I feel it does.
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Originally Posted by ChassisWelder
If a child has bronchitis and needs an antibiotic, should they be allowed to just wait it out because their medicine tastes "yucky?" How about immunizations?
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A few things come to mind. Antibiotics and extremely addictive stimulants with some pretty severe side-affects are definitely not very comparable. How about immunizations? They are just as questionable as stimulants in my opinion. Many are great, and I've provided them for my child as recommended, but as long as you mention it, I'm not a big advocate of self-poisoning for potential avoidance of future problems. I'm a bigger fan of maintaining good health through diet and exercise. Anyway, I see your point, but I've thought of that and your extreme point I don't think really lands here.
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Originally Posted by ChassisWelder
What I'm suggesting is that while yes, they should be allowed to make their own adult decisions, YOUR actions may be directly responsible for what is made out of their adulthood. If their behavior becomes so disruptive that they are kicked out of school, turn to other activities such as drugs/crime out of boredom, was it really that good of an idea to let them go without medication?
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Thank you. I agree, and this is exactly what I am wrestling with.
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Originally Posted by ChassisWelder
It's not as though a child can't be taken off the drugs eventually. Perhaps he/she will appreciate the praise they receive when their behavior is controlled, they start doing well in school, and stop acting out to where they are GLAD they were placed on the medication. You can't really allow them to make an apples to apples comparison without that second set of apples.
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This is the type of reply I guess I didn't expect. Saying you can just take them off if it doesn't work is really a horrible way to make a plan in any scenario, in my opinion. At that point some of the psychological damage could have already been done. Anyway, I still think you are correct. It may very well be helpful, but snorting a big rail of meth before you start spring cleaning is helpful, too, and you'll surely be pleased with the end result of the cleaning. I don't mean to patronize, and I really appreciate you chiming in. This is honestly that way I look at it, though.
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Originally Posted by Crompsin
Amen. Parents. Parents. Parents. Uh... what's that word, again?
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I don't even know what this means, but I've worked very diligently to be a great parent. I came here to try and further my knowledge of how to do so.
guccilvr, thank you for that post. I did find it interesting. I am worried that more bad will come over time, but I accept that certainly more good information will come as well.
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Originally Posted by genuinegirly
Maybe she just needs a different learning environment. Perhaps there's nothing wrong with your daughter (yes, she has ADD, but is that really wrong??), but the learning environment just isn't for her.
I'm sorry if there are some die-hard Montessori supporters out there, but not every 4 year old is capable of succeding in this environment. Some require more attention and structure. Especially children who cannot create their own structure - they need someone to show them what it's like to focus.
By choosing not to medicate your child, you will always deal with the fact that most primary school teachers are not educated on how to keep healthy, unmedicated ADD/ ADHD children in line. This means you'll have to take a more active role. If she's diagnosed ADD/ ADHD by a physician, great! Start talking with the disability folks in your school district and learn what your rights are. You're under no obligation to medicate your child, no matter how many times her teachers ask you to do it. You will have to push for your child's rights.
I've seen and heard about lots of work-arounds. From things as minor as sending the child to grab a book or otherwise move every 10 minutes, to using a yoga ball as a chair, to keep them moving, using exciting interactive pens, and focusing in on readings and lectures by drawing pictures while everyone else pays attention in other ways. I've also heard the alternatives of these, including offering them no distractions, plain pencils, boring reading, and just asking them to tap their foot at any and all times.
My sister was diagnosed at age 17. She chose to take the medications only long enough to graduate high school. She went off them after finals. She learned that she could focus better with them, but she lost a part of her personality. She did fine in her college courses without medication, partially because she knew what it was like to be medicated and actively wanted to avoid it.
By choosing to medicate a child at a young age, they never know the energetic part of themselves, they never learn to work with it.
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I don't know how much more active my role could get. I have been very active. I have been in constant communication with her schools' faculties. I requested that her school get a behavioral specialist in on this. We've had a few meetings, and they'll be performing a comprehensive behavioral evaluation. For those of you who don't know, at least in Missouri, public schools are required to do this upon request, though there may be a long line.
Regarding Montessori school; I totally agree. This is not the correct environment for some children, although it is arguably vastly superior to public schools for many children. This is precisely why we put her right back into the public school after a few months at Montessori. As it turns out, she does require structure that Montessori does not offer.
Your statment about not getting to see the side of them present without the drugs is exactly what prompted all of this. I'm not worn out of parenting a difficult kid. I have a lot of patience. I just want to to be the most awesome adult she can be. I fear I would take that away from her by altering things like her creativity, capability to multitask in uncanny ways, and most importantly her sense of self.
Anyway, once again. Thanks to everybody for taking interest in this and providing me with some things to think about. I'll be sure and keep checking this, and if any interesting updates come I'll let you know.