http://web.archive.org/web/200703070...8&nh=0&ssect=0
The fires at Kader toy actually involved only two buildings, a one story building and an "E" shaped, four story building. The fire occurred in Thailand, in a relatively remote area, hindering fire fighting response time. No data on what the capabilities of the "50 pieces of firefighting equipment" actually were, or about water sources at the scene...i.e., high pressure hydrants, nearby pond, trucked in water on board fire fighting apparatus....???
The buildings were not steel framed high rise towers....
From page 2 of the above linked source:
Quote:
http://web.archive.org/web/200703051...8&nh=0&ssect=1
.....The Building's Structural Integrity
Probably the most notable difference between the Triangle and Kader fires is the effect they had on the structural integrity of the buildings involved. Even though the Triangle fire gutted the top three floors of the ten-storey factory building, the building remained structurally intact. The Kader buildings, on the other hand, collapsed relatively early in the fire because their structural steel supports lacked the fireproofing that would have allowed them to maintain their strength when exposed to high temperatures. A post-fire review of the debris at the Kader site showed no indication that any of the steel members had been fireproofed.......
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....and early in Byrnison's post #46:
Quote:
....Based on the most stringent standard of the ASTM E119 test for fire survivability of materials, structural/firewalling members need to be able to survive for at most 4 hours (2 hours in some instances, I do not know what the code was for WTC7) in a time-temperature profile deemed to be attributable to a standard fire. The test assumes that sources of cooling or fire fighting will be taking place within that time frame. <h3>The observed events are that the fires burned for approximately 7 hours with no firefighting crews to put them out</h3>, and the point of failure seems to have occurred in the interior of the building - the area least likely to have external sources of cooling.
Interestingly, I ran across some stories about steel framed buildings collapsing from fires after I last posted.....
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From my post #180, in the original thread:
Quote:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...=115961&page=5
(From the first NY Times quote box displayed in post #176-
"But experts said no building like it, a modern, steel-reinforced high-rise, had ever collapsed because of an uncontrolled fire, and engineers have been trying to figure out exactly what happened and whether they should be worried about other buildings like it around the country.")
FROM THE OFFICIAL ONGOING WTC 7 COLLAPSE INVESTIGATION, JUST 75 MONTHS AND ONE WEEK, AFTER 9/11:
NIST audio/slide visuals presentation at 12/18/07 "progress" meeting:
Quote:
....1:01:40
You said fire in WTC 1 and 2 moved every 20 minutes....in any given locations...fire front....<h3>fuels feeding fire were consumed, and moved every 20 minutes...fires on multiple floors on WTC 7 were recorded, fires were actually moving at that rate, about every rule of thumb, 10 lbs. fuel per sq ft. one hour 40 min., and 4 lbs. per sq. ft., lasts 20 min. The height of the temp reached and not the duration, is the factor.....</h3>
01:05:45
Heat elements in large spans has the effect of sagging.....
01:07:30
Once fire front passes, still much heat and temperatures may not cool down....
01:08:30
Model is more like a series of burners coming on every 20 minutes, all of the heat on the backside of the fireproofing, fire dynamics models, thermal, and gas temps, fireproofing thickness, all taken into account in the models.... maybe fireproofing doesn't work? I'll hold off until all analysis is concluded before a statement will be made about design practices...
( I stopped listening at 01:12:30 out of 01:38:33 total time.)
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I am sorry, but I don't see anything provided in the contents of the posts this week that seriously challenges anything that has come before, and, if you're comparisons were so compelling, and obvious, the NIST's WTC 7 collapse investigation, would not be incomplete, in this, the 77th month after the collapse, would it?