View Single Post
Old 01-29-2008, 04:18 AM   #261 (permalink)
host
Banned
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
Quote:
Originally Posted by host
I'm assuming that meeting the notification requirements of your law would be a pre-condition of abortion. That would be a "foot in the door", to make a woman jump through a "new hoop", to exercise a right, already in law, for the past 38 years.
I don't know. This is how compromise works. I offer something up where I have sacrificed part of my position in the interest of finding a mutually acceptable solution for both parties.
Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rekna
What if she lies that she doesn't know who it is?
I'm of two minds on the answer to this. On the one hand, preventing her from having an abortion could be a violation of Roe v. Wade, but on the other hand lying to the police is illegal. Perhaps she can have the abortion (to appease pro-choicers and to not interfere with Roe v. Wade), but the standard penalty for lying to a police officer is applied. This is assuming that the father doesn't have a verifiable history of violence.
will, I trust your judgment, your ethics, your stated objection to abortion, along with your commitment not to seek to outlaw it, and....even with all of that said, I see you describing a police interrogation where the subject does not have the option of asserting a right to refuse to incriminate herself. This has developed from an understandable concern for men not being bypassed in a decision process that they have a stake in, a compelling interest to be included in, but now you've conjured up in my mind, armed men in uniform, questioning a woman to gain contact information about her sex partner(s).

It confirms some of my gravest conerns, and it is that foot in the door. I can see a party involved in fertilizing an ovum having standing because of an interest in the welfare and outcome, and I do want to be reasonable, especailly now that you have actually posted about one of my concerns, the "enforcement process" associated with your notification obligation.

Describe the methodolgy of enforcing your proposed notification steps and requirements, and I'll tell you whether it goes beyond my concept of a "foot in the door", "line in the sand". I think it would have some potential if the female were to forfeit something, other than her right to choose, if she did not comply with notification requirments.

If it wasn't for the fact that a mother cannot forfeit her child's right to paternal financial support, other than delay or denial of abortion services, or criminalization and enforcement of notification....it seems inconsequential if it isn't mandatory, I don't see how notification could be guaranteed or even the routine reaction.

If you can propose a way, I'd want to read it. I've gotten past my objection to the invasion of privacy of a new requirement to even volunteer to give information about sexual activity and sexual partners to a party other than a medical services provider, in strict confidence, solely for the purpose of potenitally involving the male partner. Because I view this as the road to a "foot in the door", and because I see common, if not frequent instances when a woman would not want to participate in or volunteer for notification, I can't visualize a proposal to do notification that would have any teeth.

I see a process that would turn into what you touched on...risk of perjury, and questioning by police, a judge, or both. In the process of compromising, one side has something the other side wants, and is willing to offer in return. The reason I asked if you would be possibly opting to challenge the right to choose, if you cannot achieve what you want via compromise, is because it would probably be the best way to negotiate a compromise.

I can see a day where abortion providers are required to have a pamphlet urging paternal notification, prominently displayed in an initial interview area for pregnant prospective clients. The potential for mandatory counseling is the added agenda of lumping enough required curriculum to extend the counseling into the third trimester.

Last edited by host; 01-29-2008 at 04:21 AM..
host is offline  
 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360