Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ustwo
The average salary in 1930-1939 was $1368 annually.
host you are really unclear on the concept.
I'd also add that the homes are a HELL of a lot nicer these days, most back then were very cramped, one bathroom, and would have much larger families in them.
You know I've only looked at 3 articles posted by you in several weeks host, one didn't support your point at all, one you completely misinterpreted or misrepresented, and this one you don't seem to understand.
I pay my dental assistants more in a week (before your kinds taxes) and more in two weeks real money (after taxes) than the average annual income was when you posted those house prices.
|
Will you please stop your bullshit personal attacks? I don't know WTF you are talking about. I do not think that you do. You posted no link to support your 1930's income figure.
I stand by what I posted:
In 2006, the median annual household income according to the US Census Bureau was determined to be $48,201.00.
http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/03200.../new04_001.htm
The 2006 average household income is 35.23 times your $1368 1930's income.
Fannie Mae funds no mortgage loan higher than $417,000, (iI am taking pains to be fair to your "argument") so their average loan is lower than the average of all mortgage loans.
In my last post, I supported the figure of average mortgage size in the 1930's HOLC program as $2320. <h3>$172,000 is 74.13 times $2320....</h3>
In these
Quote:
http://www.city-data.com/top2.html
Estimated median household income in 2005: $116,500 (it was $106,478 in 2000)
Englewood Cliffs $116,500
Estimated median house/condo value in 2005: $944,300 (it was $507,100 in 2000)
Englewood Cliffs $944,300
http://www.city-data.com/city/Englew...ew-Jersey.html
Estimated median household income in 2005: $210,500 (it was $200,001 in 2000)
Atherton $210,500
Estimated median house/condo value in 2005: $1,626,400 (it was $1,000,001 in 2000)
Atherton $1,626,400
http://www.city-data.com/city/Atherton-California.html
|
Above, it is easy to see that income in the highest average income city and in the lowest, of the 100 cities listed in the US, did not keep pace with rising home prices.
In Atherton, CA, and in Englewood Cliffs, NJ, average home prices were about 8 times average household income, in 2005.
The highest priced, post 1932 house on the list in my last post was located in Oakland, California, priced at $7150. Using your average national income figure of $1368, that Oakland house was priced at 5.22 times average national annual household income.
<h3>Please review your accusations in your last post. I've supported my contention that the core problem is that housing prices have risen dramatically above income, as have average mortgage size, compared to historical "norms".</h3>
In my post #18 here:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?p=2354202
I responded to your criticism (attack) (contained in your post #15).
I did not respond to the criticism you levied in this post:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showpos...3&postcount=57
..because I am weary from your groundless and needless critcism. In the post I authored on that thread that you criticized, I made it clear that the study that I cited data and conclusions from (you called it cherry picking) was biased towards making conclusions on wealth distribution, based on numbers of savings accounts opened and maintained by 25-35 year olds:
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by host
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...13#post2355013
This is a recent study, and it is consistent with data covering all US age groups. I predict that the response will be that "they are young", and the fact will be ignored or downplayed,that the gains in income and wealth accumulation are confined to the top 20 percent, as every other set of data also indicates....
<i>Page 2
The proportion of this population that possesses a savings account or other fi-
nancial assets has declined significantly, as has median net worth.
Between 1985 and 2004, net worth grew almost 20 percent for those in the top quintile of
the wealth distribution and fell for the other 80 percent. This decline was most pro-
nounced for those in the bottom 20 percent of the distribution.</i>
<h3>There is a heavy emphasis on declining numbers of savings accounts.</h3> Where would the money come from for the masses to deposit in the bank. The money is not reaching them and the costs of basics...housing, food, transportation have risen dramatically since 2001.
|
You may not have known that the study was part of a campaign to encourage savings accounts:
http://www.aicpa.org/financialliteracy/FeedThePig/
...or that it was irrelevant to make a comparison between savings accounts per capita in 2006 vs. 1985, because:
Quote:
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...5BC0A963948260
LOWER MORTGAGE RATES BRING OUT SHOPPERS IN DROVES
By FAY S. JOYCE
<h3>Published: August 11, 1985</h3>
WITH interest rates down to their lowest level in at least five years, brokers and builders report that metropolitan-area residents are out in force shopping for housing.
Last week, fixed-rate mortgages in the metropolitan area were averaging 12 to 12 1/4 percent, with perhaps 2 to 4 percent of the mortgage amount due at the closing. Some competitive lenders' rates run even lower -and mortgage companies report they are doing a strong business.
On a 30-year $100,000 mortgage, for example, the monthly payment at 12 percent is $1,028.62. <h3>As recently as January, interest rates were 13 1/4 percent</h3>, requiring monthly payments of $1,125.78 - a saving of $97.16 a month.....
....In general, prices have gone up. The average price of a house sold through M.L.S. in Nassau County in June was $148,700, compared with $122,500 a year earlier. In Queens, the average was $122,500, compared with $82,000 in June 1984. In western Suffolk, it was $128,100 against $104,800 a year earlier. ACCORDING to Gilbert Mercurio, executive vice president of the Westchester County M.L.S., residential sales prices reached $225,570 for a single family house in the second quarter of this year, up from $181,499 the year before. Condominiums, which account for 22 percent of the county's residential sales, cost an average of $103,650 last June and $84,971 the year before.
''It's difficult to find a house under $100,000 in good areas,'' said Verna Townsley, a broker associate with Papp Realty on Staten Island. ''It's very difficult for first-time buyers. I feel sorry for them. People can just about buy a baloney sandwich at the closing.''
But for many buyers, the lower rates have meant the ability to qualify for a mortgage large enough to buy the house they may have wanted before but could not afford. The first-time buyer - who normally is least able to make a down payment large enough to make monthly debt service affordable - has been most favored by this change.
Kenneth R. Kaan and his wife Debra, both in their 20's and working, bought their first house in East Brunswick, N. J. as interest rates were dropping. Their two-story, two-bedroom colonial cost less than $90,000. Their mortgage is $700 a month.
''I watched the market trend and shopped around for a reasonable mortgage,'' Mr. Kaan said, and found one with a 30-year term and a fixed rate of 12 1/2 percent. ''I'm very happy with how I made out. That's what we're programmed to think now,'' he said with a laugh. ''A cheap home is under $100,000 and a good mortgage rate is 12 1/2 percent.'...
|
...in 1985, savings account interest rates were probably triple what they were in 2006, with inflation trending similarly in both periods. I posted that I was citing the income and wealth distribution figures in the study because they were current, and you attacked, me, as you did here, baselessly.