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Originally Posted by Midnight
just so you realize every one of us will have a COMPLETELY different idea of what we want for this one tec....
ok, i'll bite -
He must be able to get up, bathe, dress appropriately, go to (and KEEP) a job, pay his bills on time, not be wallowing in debt, (some is fine, but a LOT is not). come home from work and after a reasonable "winding down" time - participate in whatever personal, family or social (within reason) activity is required with a minimum of fuss. He must be able to have at least a minimal grasp of why women think that a new vacuum cleaner (used DAILY) is (in our opinion) more important than spending the same amount of money for ball game tickets for that weekend. hmm.. Must be able to tolerate a house full of women having oh i don't know - a tupperware party or something once in a while if he expects to have his buddies around for the game on sunday. must NEVER use personal grooming implements on fishing line, wire, (finger nail clippers) or to turn screws "in a pinch" (tweezers, nail files) if he expects his beard/moustache trimmer not to be used for the pelvic region. mmm, If he doesn't want his shaving cream used for our legs etc, he can't bitch about us spending the money on the "girlie equivalent" Ah! He must not be a "shedder" ie: walk in the house, take off coat, drop, take a step, kick off shoe, take a step, kick off other shoe, take a step, toss keys on table, take a step, set briefcase/bag down, take a step - and so on. STOP AT THE DOOR. USE THE CLOSET. Must realize that unless they make enough for a housekeeper, they do NOT have one, and everyone there should do their part not to trash the house. BE OBSERVANT - if every time you "put X "there" your female MOVES IT, and it is always moved TO THE SAME PLACE - wake up and just put it there to begin with - your chosen place to put said item is unacceptable and we don't feel we should have to tell you where it belongs. we don't move your shit because we love you and want to pick up after you, we move it because where you put it ANNOYS US.
I'll stop here, because this is getting long, and its just the TIP of the iceberg. I have people that ask me ALL THE TIME why I am not in a relationship. I am not because I realize I am picky, and am sick of settling for less than what I want. It's easier to be alone than to train a man not to fuck up with me.
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I'm just gonna take a stab at this - it sounds like the beef over Midnight's list directly relates to tec's original point. There are some things about women that baffle men (like our behavior around that time of month...) and it seems that women can be a lot more introspective than men (our habit of noting things you may do only to bring them up a month later). It HAPPENS even in the tightest of relationships. Hence the entire section of the bookstore devoted to relations between the sexes.
If the men out there can explain why Sex in the City is such a great show, please stand up (the answer is not "shoes").
Point being, there are some fundamental differences in how our brains are wired.
Midnight's list should be taken with a grain of salt. Anyone who takes it as a literal make-or-break set of rules must have missed the underlying point.
I assume what Midnight is saying (in order) is that it's very NICE when our mate ...
1.) Respects and takes care of himself (job/grooming/debt)
2.) Likes to spend time with us after work so we can enjoy each other's company (winding down)
3.) Is willing to work out a compromise if something is important to us (vacuum)
4.) Allows us to be ourselves as we allow him to be himself (tupperware/ball game)
5.) Respects our stuff (grooming implements)
6.) Is considerate of our shared space and also notices when we have thoughtfully made a special place for his shoes and coat so he can always find them and doesn't trip over stuff in the dark hallway.
I don't think that's too much to ask and the list works both ways. Do you want to date some woman who refuses to get a job/shower, won't spend time with you, doesn't respect your needs/interests/records/golf clubs/special snacky food/tv programs/weekly poker game/baseball card collection/desire to own a Wii, PS3 AND XBox 360 etc., and is a slob that always leaves a mess?????
Of course there are ups and downs and sometimes you want to slob about cuz you're tired after a long workday (sometimes we do too) - we respect that. Hell, I'll even respect your period of unemployment cuz I want you to find a job you enjoy ... but there are also shitteous moochy people (of both sexes) out there that never grasp the concept of partnership and cohabitation. Most of the guys on this board are nice and intelligent - if you occasionally practice the things on the list, you've got nothing to complain about.
If you don't... well, by all means keep bitching about unreasonable expectations! I wish more of the sucky guys I've dated were up front about their inability to handle a serious relationship!
Anyway, it sounds like the animosity stems from a communication problem (huh, how novel) - e.g. how Midnight phrased it - and not what's actually on the list...
...which I feel demonstrates the reason tec started this thread in the first place - to forge better communication between the sexes.
So don't hate, appreciate.