View Single Post
Old 06-29-2007, 08:43 PM   #89 (permalink)
analog
Banned
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShaniFaye
gee all those quotes from studies from doctors about how great it is....and I don't see one of them explaining why none of that worked pre 20th century to keep the infant mortality rate down

I highly resent anyone that tells my I'm less of a caring mother because I didn't breastfeed
Two reasons that the above assertion/judgment is incorrect:

Breast milk is not an antibiotic, but contains white blood cells with antigen information which helps your child's own immune system build much more quickly. This is extremely advantageous for the child, and why a major "way of thinking" is that it's an essential part of the baby's nutrition. That being said, I agree that it's assholish to tell someone they're less of a caring mother because they don't breastfeed.

However, we don't know what the infant mortality rates would have been WITHOUT breast milk during that long-ago time period. So... there's no data to compare and say whether it did or not. Saying "it didn't work" is like saying seatbelts don't save lives, "so many" thousands of people die every year, if you didn't know how many people died in similar crashes without them. It's an incredibly flawed, one-way-thinking postulate.

Jenny Hatch:

Your methodology and "information" is being questioned because both are speciously constructed and rely heavily on pulling someone in with emotional, not logical or rational, talk to get them to swallow whole what you're attempting to feed them. That's why you're having an issue "reaching out". Appealing to sentiment, rather than to information and logic, will get you shut out of people's minds in record time.

The bottom line is, "natural" does not automatically equal "better" or "good". Yes, people birthed without any help for all time. That doesn't mean that the introduction of some medical professional is without merit. You are lucky/blessed (whichever word you prefer) to have many healthy children. Not everyone births perfectly every single time. In fact, lots of people don't.

And if he's so into "home" and "free" birthing, why have a center? That's like starting a membership club for anarchists, it's completely contrary to the purpose.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JinnKai
That's a damn slippery slope. If someone chooses to smoke and ends up with lung cancer, you think that cancer treatment is thereby an "elective" procedure? Universal health care shouldn't cover this person's treatment (and possibly preventing their DEATH) because they made a bad choice?
I encourage debate on all topics, but I can't respond to asinine comparisons like "lung cancer from smoking"- which would mean withholding life saving care and "I chose to have a baby, now pay for it". Smoking may have been a choice, but saying that anyone should have lifesaving care withheld because it was their choice that put them there, is just plain awful.

Quote:
There are a lot of choices to make in life, and many of them are bad. The idea of "Universal Health Care," however, is to prevent and treat human suffering and death. I fail to see how "choices" they make are even relevant. The fact is that they're suffering now.
Right. Suffering and death. Treating illness and trauma. So what you're trying to say is... universal healthcare should pay for childbirth because it falls under the heading of "human suffering and death"?

And there's a huge difference between "accidental" pregnancy and "intentional" pregnancy. We pay for the ignorance and irresponsibility of people every day, accidental pregnancy due to either of those factors is hardly any different. Covering all pregnancy, fully, writes a blank check on my tax dollars for all their care. People bitch ALL the time about how expensive having a child is... you want all of that, for every woman in the US, to get tacked into our tax burden?

For the record, I'm not against universal healthcare. My opinion is that having a child is a choice (which it is, unless it's an accident, which isn't what we're talking about), and should be treated as elective medical care (not paid for universally).

Last edited by analog; 06-29-2007 at 09:17 PM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
analog is offline  
 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360