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Originally Posted by shakran
Yes. When you have a well established concept that people have believed in for millenia, I do think it would be awfully nice if you'd have some sort of evidence to back up your side before you trash theirs. You can bring up all the silly BS examples of modern hoaxes and paranoid conspiracy theories, but when you get right down to it there is a difference between that and well-established religion. A difference I'm sure you're praying I don't point out. People who believe in god aren't generally doing it because it's cool, or because they're making it up, or because they're nuts. They have, in their mind, very good reasons for their belief. An atheist who whines about religious intolerance has absolutely no right to be intolerant of religion. You can try to draw comparisons between belief in religion and belief in martians if you wish, but you and I both know that no one here is going to be fooled. You may as well give up that line of attack. It's not gonna work.
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I think a lot is being revealed, here.
You indicated, earlier, that you didn't like these analogies and you're saying that again, here. You say that this "line of attack" is not going to work and I'm inclined to agree with you since... it's not working. However, I don't understand why you pretend that I know what you're talking about and then not reveal the big secret "I'm praying you don't point out?" What's with the melodrama? This is supposed to be a message board of mature discourse. Talk to me! What's the distinction? They're both just as unreasonable and perfectly analogous. If you know how they are different, why won't you just say it? It would certainly help quell my incredulity over religion...
I understand that no amount of reasoning will convince the faithful. That's what faith is for. All we can hope to do is plant seeds. Some may be convinced. Other's may think about it, later. Maybe my words are utterly ineffectual. However, I'm not sure I can pretend that religion makes any sense just because I think the debate is futile...
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Why is "I don't believe" conciliatory. You're saying you don't buy in to what they're telling you is the truth. That is not conciliatory. Unless you define conciliatory as "not being a jerk," then you're off base here.
It's essentially the same thing I said.
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That's just the impression it gives me. If you think "I think this is unreasonable" is unoffensive, I can live with that. Of course, I can't speak for the other atheists in this thread...
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Yeah, I thought we went over it too. If a deeply religious person is trying to infringe on your rights, then go after THAT PERSON. Not everyone who happens to have the misfortune of having you find out he believes in god.
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What if an institution is infringing upon my rights? How would you feel about my going after that institution? It can be argued that I only have a problem with organized religion. Would that make you feel better?
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I didn't ignore it. I reiterated it. So you're unique. Great. Others aren't quite so forgiving in their willingness to consider your thoughts when your words are so abrasive.
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This is getting a little off topic but I'll go for it. You didn't reiterate my point. My point was not that I'm unique, which is what you reiterated. My point was that you'd be surprised and that made no sense, which is what you ignored. I understand that the religious aren't as forgiving (ironically); that's what makes me unique...