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Originally Posted by The_Jazz
As far as infrastructure and the responsibility for its upkeep, I am 100% sure that the UN absolutely never takes responsibility for maintenance on roads, etc., especially when they aren't acting as an occupying force. Saying that the sanctions were the direct cause of the deterioration is a big red herring. Sactions certainly CONTRIBUTED, but the Saddam regime certainly could have spent the money if they chose. Granted, they would have had to take money from other causes (military, etc.), which realistically never would have (and didn't) happen, but the fact remains that the UN contributes $0 in 0 countries for infrastructure maintenance. They will, on occassion, contribute to one-off projects, but maintenance is a completely separate interest and is the sole responibility of a sovereign state.
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Ah, but that's not exactly true. Saddam DID take money from military to fund things like roads, but it simply wasn't enough. The fact is, the UN knew what would happen if they imposed sanctions, everything from starvation to disease to the general degredation of all state run programs, including roads. They know that the Iraqi economy was already unstable, and simply pulled the last jenga piece out. Of course the place fell apart. The blame lies with Saddam, the UN, the US, and many other factors. The UN wasn't the only cause, but to discount them is irresponsible. The Saddam regime did try to maintain the state, but it couldn't.
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Originally Posted by The_Jazz
The fact remains that the Iraqi infrastructure is substantially better than that which was left over at the end of WWII. Highways, railroads, factories, water, etc. are all in much better shape than the urban areas of the remains of Nazi Germany. There are no masses of displaced people, there are no bombed out cities, and frankly, the standard of living in Iraq is better than that of the average German in 1945 (granted 60 years of progress certainly effected that fact).
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Yes, but that does have to be taken into account. Had Saddam not ben sanctioned, it's probable that he would have done everything in his power to bring trade to his country, and that is done by taking similar steps as Germany after WWI.
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Originally Posted by The_Jazz
Your suggestion sound workable, but as soon as we make something attack-proof, someone's going to invent a better attack. It's the way of the world.
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Ah, but escelation takes time, and we're talking about starting the withdrawl as soon as we impliment the new strategy. We need to leave as soon as possible. We need to get out oil elsewhere. We need to have Bush and Cheney publicly hung for ignoring inteligence that has directly lead to the deaths of thousands of our own soldiers and the deaths of countless (I say countless because everyone loves to skew the numbers) of Iraqis. We were and are not liberators. We are invaders and we've paid a terrible price.