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Willravel · 11-27-2006, 10:15 PM

Okay, this is a tough one. We've been reading "Support our Troops" bumper magnets for 3 or 4 years now. We've heard it as a middleground between pro and anti war up until very recently, whether it be the I support our troops, so we need to be in Iraq rhetoric or the I support our troops, so we need them home rhetoric. I'm sure we all know someone, are related to someone, or even are someone who has served in the military. It's recently become a very heated subject due to the vast polarization and also prison, torture, and rape scandals. Our troops get injured, lose limbs, or even lose their lives.

So here we go:
Do you support the troops?
Yes: why, and how do you support them?
No: why, and why not?
I don't know: what makes you think twice?

I'll start. I know that the US never really had any business being in Iraq in 2003. Saddam had been steadily losing power for over a decade, he had goe back and fourth between being open with the UN inspectors and being an arrogant asshat. The question of whether he had weapons kept being brought up again and again. It was clear that under Clinton, Iraq would be bombed, but never invaded. We sanctioned, killing an unknown number of innocent people that had nothing to do with the invasion of Kuwait. The 9/11 happened, and Bushco took advantage of our patriotism. Iraq was invaded based on either falsified or massively incorrect information. Many civilians died in the "Shock and Awe" campaign. We invaded claiming that Iraq had not abandoned the UN resolutions, even though we had no real connection to the situation besides being a member of the UN. The US was never really in any danger. The whitehouse claimed that there was a link between Iraq and the al Qaeda. There was, of course, no link. Our soldiers, the main portion of the Coalition Provisional Authority, took the brunt of the responsibility for keeping the peace after the "War" was declaired as a victory. That's when the insurgency started. Soldiers were attacked. Insurgents were attacked. Civilians were attacked. Children were attacked. The military wasn't sure how to deal with the problem. Prisoners were heald without trial, because as we weren't technically at war, they were not POWs and were not subject to the Geneva Convention. They were tortured. Innocent people were incarcerated. It was covered up pretty well until some very immature and bad soldiers took some very disgusting pictures that were leaked to the media. Suddenly the "support our troops" standby line wasn't so simple.

Kidnappings. No trials. Humiliation. Torture. Coverups. Accedental killings. Murders. Rapes.

IMHO, the soldiers are like a cross section of our society. There are brave people, there are smart people, but there are also cowards and idiots. A lot of very smart people have weighed the moral implications, then they have made an informed decision whether to continue serving or to leave. Some have stayed, some have left. Those are the troops that I support. Some, however, simply serve. They follow the party line and they do whatever they're told. Shooting guns and driving tanks is fun, and damn the consequences because it's a party. Then reality sets in and fun is replaced by anger. These are the troops I don't support. Those who say that they are in Iraq to protect our freedoms, as if lining the pockets of our rich is somehow saving our freedom of speech. They say that torturing detainees (we can't call them POWs) is saving me from terrorism, even though any expert trained in psychology could explain how useless intel from torture is completly unreliable. I cannot support them. I'm sorry, I know they think they're risking their life for me or for some high ideal like liberty or justice, but that's just not the case.

I'm sure some might say that I'm not a soldier so I can't understand. Well I've made a lifetime commitment before. I've been shot at. I've defended people from danger. I'm an active member of the ACLU, the anti-war movement, and the impeachment movement. I vote at every opportunity, and have done so since I turned 18. I do serve my country in the way I think serves it best.

Also, I'd like to apologize if I offended you, NCB. I am very opinionated, that's the way I've been since I was a sophmore in HS. Sometimes my big opinions piss people off. I never set out to disrespect someone, just to speak my mind. Sometimes I do both.

11-27-2006, 10:15 PM	#1 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Support our troops.... Okay, this is a tough one. We've been reading "Support our Troops" bumper magnets for 3 or 4 years now. We've heard it as a middleground between pro and anti war up until very recently, whether it be the I support our troops, so we need to be in Iraq rhetoric or the I support our troops, so we need them home rhetoric. I'm sure we all know someone, are related to someone, or even are someone who has served in the military. It's recently become a very heated subject due to the vast polarization and also prison, torture, and rape scandals. Our troops get injured, lose limbs, or even lose their lives. So here we go: Do you support the troops? Yes: why, and how do you support them? No: why, and why not? I don't know: what makes you think twice? I'll start. I know that the US never really had any business being in Iraq in 2003. Saddam had been steadily losing power for over a decade, he had goe back and fourth between being open with the UN inspectors and being an arrogant asshat. The question of whether he had weapons kept being brought up again and again. It was clear that under Clinton, Iraq would be bombed, but never invaded. We sanctioned, killing an unknown number of innocent people that had nothing to do with the invasion of Kuwait. The 9/11 happened, and Bushco took advantage of our patriotism. Iraq was invaded based on either falsified or massively incorrect information. Many civilians died in the "Shock and Awe" campaign. We invaded claiming that Iraq had not abandoned the UN resolutions, even though we had no real connection to the situation besides being a member of the UN. The US was never really in any danger. The whitehouse claimed that there was a link between Iraq and the al Qaeda. There was, of course, no link. Our soldiers, the main portion of the Coalition Provisional Authority, took the brunt of the responsibility for keeping the peace after the "War" was declaired as a victory. That's when the insurgency started. Soldiers were attacked. Insurgents were attacked. Civilians were attacked. Children were attacked. The military wasn't sure how to deal with the problem. Prisoners were heald without trial, because as we weren't technically at war, they were not POWs and were not subject to the Geneva Convention. They were tortured. Innocent people were incarcerated. It was covered up pretty well until some very immature and bad soldiers took some very disgusting pictures that were leaked to the media. Suddenly the "support our troops" standby line wasn't so simple. Kidnappings. No trials. Humiliation. Torture. Coverups. Accedental killings. Murders. Rapes. IMHO, the soldiers are like a cross section of our society. There are brave people, there are smart people, but there are also cowards and idiots. A lot of very smart people have weighed the moral implications, then they have made an informed decision whether to continue serving or to leave. Some have stayed, some have left. Those are the troops that I support. Some, however, simply serve. They follow the party line and they do whatever they're told. Shooting guns and driving tanks is fun, and damn the consequences because it's a party. Then reality sets in and fun is replaced by anger. These are the troops I don't support. Those who say that they are in Iraq to protect our freedoms, as if lining the pockets of our rich is somehow saving our freedom of speech. They say that torturing detainees (we can't call them POWs) is saving me from terrorism, even though any expert trained in psychology could explain how useless intel from torture is completly unreliable. I cannot support them. I'm sorry, I know they think they're risking their life for me or for some high ideal like liberty or justice, but that's just not the case. I'm sure some might say that I'm not a soldier so I can't understand. Well I've made a lifetime commitment before. I've been shot at. I've defended people from danger. I'm an active member of the ACLU, the anti-war movement, and the impeachment movement. I vote at every opportunity, and have done so since I turned 18. I do serve my country in the way I think serves it best. Also, I'd like to apologize if I offended you, NCB. I am very opinionated, that's the way I've been since I was a sophmore in HS. Sometimes my big opinions piss people off. I never set out to disrespect someone, just to speak my mind. Sometimes I do both.