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Originally Posted by dksuddeth
obviously, all of us who are blaming the cops are wrong and you're right. how 'misguided' of us.
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Because you're blaming the police, and not the judge, yes- yes I am.
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And you are the supreme authority on what is and isn't trash media?
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And you wonder why I act like the thread has succumbed to hyperbole.
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As I said before, we've given up on judges. They are useless as servants of the people. The only thing most of them do now is perform as tools of the bloated government machine.
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The "government machine"? I hate the government as much as the next person, but the way you talk about this subject reveals the intractable bias with which you convey this story. It makes me want to get out my tinfoil hat, for fear the aliens might have a hand in this as well.
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which, of course, means that as a cop, one should be given every benefit of the doubt any time a gun is pointed at them and they should be given 100x more latitude in their decision making concerning their shooting people, whereas, a civilian in the same situation is an incompetent, bumbling, foolhardy, ignorant, and totally untrained in anything concerning firearms and self defense yet is expected to know, in less time, that one's home is being invaded by armed thugs or law enforcement executing a lawful no-knock warrant. Apologist much?
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A sundry firearm and home security professional like yourself ought to know that one of the first rules of handling a firearm is don't point a gun at something/someone unless you intend to shoot. So no, the most trained "civilian" is still going to be pointing the gun, and intending to shoot, or not holding the gun at all. A "trained" person knows that when you point a gun at a person, you are telling them it's them or you. When you pick up a firearm and point it, that gives the indication you are preparing to use it- and with the use of a firearm comes responsibility for your actions. Pointing a gun bears responsibility just as firing it does.
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which is why law enforcement are most always exempted from laws that prohibit conduct or possession of such items like body armor or automatic weapons.....because their lives are on the line......so answer this question. If police, who put their lives on the line all the time, are exempted from the weapons laws that we have to adhere to....why do so many of us die when they do not?
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From your very trustworthy "agitator", and the same writer who gave us the story on which this thread is based...
http://www.theagitator.com/archives/026661.php
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The tally thus far from my research: 42 innocent people killed in paramilitary raids. 57 if you include police officers. Another 20 were nonviolent offenders (recreational pot smokers, gamblers, etc.) shot and killed either by accident or because they mistook raiding police for criminal intruders and were killed when they attempted to defend themselves, their homes, and/or their families.
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So by my count, your intrepid "reporter" scoured the internet and found 62 deaths of (non-police) "innocent people". Does anyone ever make a correlation between the likelihood of people with drugs having a gun, because they think people would bust in like a gang to rob them? I'm all for home security, but what's the likelihood of a person who associates with drug dealers to be MORE scared of getting raided by people other than the police?
http://www.odmp.org/year.php?year=2005
http://nleomf.com/TheMemorial/Facts/causes.htm
The above two websites, both official police organizations, put the police death toll at 156 and 155 for 2005. The ten-year high was 237 officers lost in 2001. It also notes that 57% of the officers killed in 2005 were wearing body armor.
Yeah, the police are cutting down civilians in record numbers, and they're hardly sustaining any losses at all; especially with all that armor and great firepower you begrudge them for having.
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Is the officers life worth more than your life? worth more than mine? worth more than your mothers life? Again, why do more of US die than them?
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As said, and as well you should know- when you point a gun, you are indicating an intent to use it. No matter who that happens to be- police, your average pothead, grandma- they will fire on you before you can fire on them. I'm sure you personally wouldn't hesitate to shoot someone who drew on you, and you shouldn't, you should take them out first. The police are not exempt from this ideal. I'd also like to see you come up with "civilian loss" numbers even rivaling police losses, let alone beating them.
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and more dead cops is CERTAINLY something that we should never have, which is why it's counterproductive to try to change things. The second we speak up about it, we have to deal with people like you who preach on and on about the holiness of law enforcement and how we should revere them for their selfless sacrifice instead of trying to save innocent lives in the course of the war on drugs.
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I'm not preaching on anything. I've smoked out plenty of times. If it were legal (and I wish it was), I'd smoke recreationally and enjoy it quite a bit. As it stands, it is currently
not legal- I do my part by voting and I help educate people by demystifying marijuana from the evil plant many believe it to be. And yes, they deserve our respect for their sacrifice. They work a dangerous job that could get them killed for no reason whatsoever, every day that they work.
They keep you and everyone else who is ungrateful for their self-sacrifice safe, they uphold the laws of the constitution you cherish and hold so tightly while flipping through your Guns'n'Ammo magazine, and they do all that while you scream bloody murder every time some moron points a gun at one of them and gets themselves shot. While this woman "didn't know" they were the police, the majority we see is an outcry because a person raised a gun to a cop and the cop shot them- surprise, surprise. Oh, I also love guns. Forgot to mention that. I'm actually trying to figure out where I've been preaching, seeing as I love marijuana and guns and think the "war on drugs" is a farce...
The reason I'm coming down on this nonsense is because your entire argument is that a person pointing a gun at a cop shouldn't have been shot- and that's completely ludicrous. If you point a gun at someone who
isn't a cop, you should expect the same result. You will be shot for pointing your gun at them. Period. The other half of your argument was blaming the police for having the raid to begin with- which we also know is false because the police cannot authorize raids. Now apparently because you've been proven wrong, the blame is now on corrupt judges. I guess the entire justice system just can't win for losin'.
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What you should try doing is renaming the 'war on (fill in the blank)' to the war on americans....because that's what it really is.
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/tinfoil hat.