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filtherton · 11-12-2006, 11:57 PM

Here's the thing. You assert that you have rights as a smoker and that business owners have rights as business owners. What you ignore are the rights of people who aren't business owners or smokers. By any definition that you've offered the rights of these groups are equivalent in scope and magnitude. Your right to smoke in a bar and a bar owner's right to allow smoking in a bar, and a person's right to go to a bar and not smell like smoke are all based on the same legal footing. There's nothing remotely inherent about any of them. By these definitions, rights only exist in the space not specifically mentioned by the legislature, or, in the case of referendums, the people directly.

The fact that you used to be able to engage in a certain activity doesn't make that activity inherently something you should always be able to do.

At some point you have to recognize that you live in a place where, if the stars are in proper alignment, people have the ability to participate in the process of making laws. Sometimes these people will make laws that you disagree with and that's just how it goes.

One flaw in your position is that you seem to think that your specific habits should fall outside the scope of what the general public can and can't regulate in a fashion that they see fit. This is a mistake. Your "rights" as a smoker depend on how much smoking society wants to put up with and once society decides to tell you no you don't have the right anymore. That's just how it is.

You could say that you want the right to smoke in bars back, but that assertion really holds no more weight than the assertion that i want the right to go to a bar and not deal with smoke. In practice, rights such as these are slippery things and it really just ends up being an agree to disagree type of thing.

Another flaw is that you support bans in places that match the criteria you've cited as the basis for your opposing bans in bars. It used to be that you could smoke everywhere. If you want to see people smoking in hospitals you just need to watch more movies from the 60's. The community college i used to go to still has ashtrays built into the walls. At some point, we all had the "right" to smoke in any private businesse that chose to allow us to smoke. Now we don't, and apparently you see some wisdom in that change.

On a side note, good luck quitting. I need to do the same thing.

11-12-2006, 11:57 PM	#190 (permalink)
filtherton Junkie Location: In the land of ice and snow.	Here's the thing. You assert that you have rights as a smoker and that business owners have rights as business owners. What you ignore are the rights of people who aren't business owners or smokers. By any definition that you've offered the rights of these groups are equivalent in scope and magnitude. Your right to smoke in a bar and a bar owner's right to allow smoking in a bar, and a person's right to go to a bar and not smell like smoke are all based on the same legal footing. There's nothing remotely inherent about any of them. By these definitions, rights only exist in the space not specifically mentioned by the legislature, or, in the case of referendums, the people directly. The fact that you used to be able to engage in a certain activity doesn't make that activity inherently something you should always be able to do. At some point you have to recognize that you live in a place where, if the stars are in proper alignment, people have the ability to participate in the process of making laws. Sometimes these people will make laws that you disagree with and that's just how it goes. One flaw in your position is that you seem to think that your specific habits should fall outside the scope of what the general public can and can't regulate in a fashion that they see fit. This is a mistake. Your "rights" as a smoker depend on how much smoking society wants to put up with and once society decides to tell you no you don't have the right anymore. That's just how it is. You could say that you want the right to smoke in bars back, but that assertion really holds no more weight than the assertion that i want the right to go to a bar and not deal with smoke. In practice, rights such as these are slippery things and it really just ends up being an agree to disagree type of thing. Another flaw is that you support bans in places that match the criteria you've cited as the basis for your opposing bans in bars. It used to be that you could smoke everywhere. If you want to see people smoking in hospitals you just need to watch more movies from the 60's. The community college i used to go to still has ashtrays built into the walls. At some point, we all had the "right" to smoke in any private businesse that chose to allow us to smoke. Now we don't, and apparently you see some wisdom in that change. On a side note, good luck quitting. I need to do the same thing.