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Originally Posted by analog
No, that is the government taking public health into account, and disallowing the habits of individuals in public places that are a detriment to the health of those around them.
Was it "the government making a choice for us" when they forced all asbestos to be removed and replaced in buildings, when it was found out to be so harmful? I guess business owners should have been given the right to choose to replace it or not- after all, we all can choose to go there or not, right?
Is it the government making a choice for us by insisting that all restuarants pass minimum food storage and preparation safety requirements? After all, we can choose to eat at whatever restaurant we want. Phooey on public health, I don't want the government telling private businesses how to run their shops!
Oh, certainly it's the government pushing us around by requiring frequent and thorough inspections of airplanes! After all, we can choose the airlines whose planes we wish to board- why should the government step in and demand things are safe and not endangering the health and lives of its citizens? Those assholes.
I can keep going.
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If you know that those things are going on and you go in there whos fault is that? You know if a bar has a non smoking policy or not. Most of those other things you mentioned are done behind the scenes where the consumer can not see nor make an educated decision to use the service/establishment.
The establishment owner is not pumping smoke into the air. He simply allows his customers to smoke if they want to. They are not trying to hurt you like you try to make it seem. No one is running around with a cigarette blowing smoke in your face saying "I hope you get cancer". YOU go there YOU get the cancer
maybe. You see there was no "they" in that sentence where YOU get cancer. Which is what you anti smokers are worried about isn't it? The YOU factor.
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The main point is that despite what you believe to be the big, bad government putting you down, they are simply removing YOUR unhealthy habit from the lungs of those people in the public with whom you happen to coexist.
If I breathe in your smoke, I am being forced to sacrifice my personal health because of your personal decisions. Do whatever you want to your own lungs, but anyone who insists they have a "right" to smoke in public places, polluting the lungs of those around them, is being ridiculous.
This is honestly a truly asinine conversation. I can't believe people are actually trying to tell us that it's their right to fuck up other people's lungs because of their personal addiction. Un-freakin'-believable.
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You don't have to coexist in the bar that a guy bought and set up and let people smoke in. Just like I don't have to coexist with you on this forum but I choose to. If I don't like something here I'll leave. I'm not going to try and change forum rules every where because you annoy me and it may raise my blood pressure and some day lead to a heart attack.
All of these anti smoking arguments are saying that it is ok to tell the "establishment owner" to not allow his customers to not do something that will hurt you if you choose to let it hurt you. Seems akin to big brother to me. No one is saying it's ok to hurt non smokers. It's not ok to hurt other people. By going into the bar people aren't hurting you, you are hurting your self.
So choose to not go. It's not the owners fault you don't smoke. Just like me telling a gay bar owner that he needs to change his bar to straight only because I'm not gay makes no sense. He shouldn't be forced to cater to you or any specific group if he doesn't want to.