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Old 10-15-2006, 04:10 PM   #60 (permalink)
Gilda
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Location: Out on a wire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JinnKai
In regards to your very well-written post above, I think we clearly agree on the goal, but not the process required to reach that goal. I agree with most of what you've said, but I hope to detail why I believe this "solution" to be quite easy below.

* Have you ever had something come so easily to you that it was nearly second nature? You did it with such ease that it seemed entirely trivial?
Yes, of course. I'd suspect everyone has. Reading for example.

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* With the understanding that you do it well, have you also recognized the ability of someone else to do the same, with minimal assistance, or instruction?
Sure. I'm surrounded with people for whom reading comes easily, both at home and at work.

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*Given the same person as above, how would you feel or behave if they claimed they couldn't do it? Claimed that it was too difficult? You know that you can do it, and you know that they can do it quite easily with dedication.

Keep in mind, again, that you've done it yourself and you've seen others do it with ease.
Let's continue with reading as an example. I learned relatively early, by about the age of six, to read fluently. My sister could do the same at the age of three. The average person in the US can do this by roughly the age on eight to nine years old, or about the time they start third grade.

Some, like my sister can learn with seemingly no outside intervention whatsoever. Some, like me, learn experientially through being read to by an older person, in my case my mom and various aunts and uncles. Most need some degree of formal instruction, and learn through one of three basic methods, sight word memorization, phonics, and experiential learning. Each of these by itself is adequate for some people, which is to say some will thrive on phonics alone, others on sight words, others on experiential. Most benefit most from an approach that combines the three.

Some have learning disabilities that render standard instruction techniques ineffective and inefficient, and require specific intervention tailored to the person's individual needs by a trained specialist. Many children who grow into illiterate adults do so because they had an undiagnosed learning disorder that prevented them from learning the necessary skills through conventional methods. Some have a physical processing deficit in the brain that needs to be overcome through a specifically tailored intervention program.

It's easy and natural for me and every person in my family and all of my professional colleages, or so far as I know. This does not mean that I'm going to assume that it's easy for everyone, that one approach is best for everyone, or that there aren't a good number of people for whom it is a long, difficult, recursive process.

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My reaction would be to buckle at the notion that it should be difficult for them, and work to convince them that it was not as difficult as they percieved. There's a multitude of ways to convince them of such - the most effective for me has been to make them (a) clearly identify their percieved 'problem' (b) make THEM provide the solution to THEIR problem. In such a way, it's internalized - much as you've described above.
I'm not saying that this approach has not worked for you. The pep talk, motivational speaker, life coach, self-help approach does work for some, and I say good for them. I'm glad they found an approach that works. I have no doubt that many people have problems that are not as large as they seemed before they began to actively deal with them.

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Alternatively, I've had success (even personally) with forcing or being forced to do something I think is difficult. While I might still suck, my vision of "difficulty" erodes greatly with each attempt.
Good for you.

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What is your reaction?
I'm happy that you've found a way to deal with your problems.

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The reason for my reaction came about through the same learning mechanism as you've detailed above. I've "learned" that making the task difficult is the first defense mechanism invoked by someone not dedicated to change. If they make it difficult, they can persuade themselves they are incapable. It's avoiding cognitive dissonance, just as you've detailed above. They believe they are not suited for difficult problems, and therefore make all problems they don't know how to solve difficult.
I have no doubt that that can be the source of some inertia. It's one of the aspects of depression, the irrational belief that ones situation cannot be improved. That a problem seems insurmountable may serve as a disincentive to deal with it.

However, often the task seems difficult and complex because it *is* difficult and complex and requires a lot of hard work. For some people with more severe problems, having someone to help guide them through the process of identifying exactly what the problem is, breaking the big problem down into smaller steps that are easier to get through, and developing a systematic approach to reaching the goals is what's needed.

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Subconciously, I believe it's quite simple.

"I know I have a problem. I see other people without a problem. It must be incredibly difficult to get rid of this problem, or I wouldn't still have it."

If they admit that it's easy, they admit that (a) they aren't trying hard enough or (b) they're not good at doing things that are easy. Admitting either of these would be very difficult - cognitive dissonance, indeed.
Or C: The task at hand, though easy for some, is not easy for all. If you are not good at a task, that task is not easy for you. "Easy" is relative to a person's skills and abilities, not an absolute measurement. Calculus is easy for my sister. It is complex, difficult to learn, and requires a lot of hard work for most people.

Believing that a difficult task is easier than it should be is also counterproductive because it can result in people giving up when they discover it isn't going to be the quick, easy solution they were promised.

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In short, my belief is that the first step to removing self-esteem and self-image concerns is not to develop intricate methods, see therapists, take drugs, or otherwise plot your path to success. It is to convince yourself that the transition is not difficult but will take dedicated effort.
That seems to be a contradiction in your last step. This may work for some. When you say it worked for you, I have no problem believing that. Our point of disagreement is in your apparent belief that this method is universally applicable.

Therapy isn't always a long, complex process. Sometimes it's as simple as having someone friendly to talk to a couple of times a month. Sometimes it's six to eight sessions of desensitization and cognitive training to rid someone of a less severe problem. Sometimes it's one session and the client discovers she has the same fears and insecurities as everyone. But some people do have severe problems that require, or at least benefit greatly from, the guidance of a skilled counselor. Therapists have training and education for dealing with specific problems in an effective manner. Even when it may not be necessary, it can still be very helpful.

Medication treats a specific physical cause of the psychological problem. It's not a panacea, but it can make treatment of the psychological problem easier and more effective.

Making a plan is nearly always a good idea. You're even offering a plan, whether it's the first step in a longer plan or a one step plan, it's still a plan.

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I believe that the largest barrier between one's current state and one's desired state is the mentality the transition would be difficult. I'd be lying if I said I was surprised by your rebuttal - not that you think you're incapable, but that you think I've oversimplified the problem or made it too easy.
I have no doubt that this is an obstacle.

I do think you are over simplifying things by proposing one simple solution for everyone for what can be a complex psychological problem, often with an underlying physical cause.

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I would never deny that the feelings are real, powerful, or overwhelming. However, the first step is changing "difficult" to "easy, but requiring dedication."

Pretty soon it becomes "easy" and then "so easy I don't even realize I do it."
Not for everyone.

Gilda

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SugahBritches
So, where some of us have our "moods" that we don't want to interact socially, you strive to actually make it to one? What I mean is, what seems to some of us as easy to do, for you it's quite stressful?
Certain social situations are quite stressful, yes. Parties, being alone in a public place, especially one that requires some form of social interaction like a restaurant or store, informal conversations in hallways and the teachers' lounge, stuff like that. For those situations, I'm always in a mood where interacting socially is uncomfortable to painful because of a fear of being judged negatively by others, or saying or doing something foolish or offensive. I do fine in written communication like this, where there's nobody physically here to see and hear me, no fear of committing some social faux pas that I'm not aware of because of my ignorance of all the little rules of social interaction.

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I don't mind socializing. However, sometimes I might feel like I'm just going through the motions of it. Other times, I don't mind it and it goes quite smoothly. I'm an outgoing person, but I find that I want my space a good bit of the time. It might be that I go to work and perform the social graces expected of me and then once I am home, I really want to just relax alone.
I can understand that. I do need something, but I generally able to get enough from my classes and from my wife and sister.

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You seem to be quite knowledgeable Gilda and I wish you success on your therapy.
Thank you.
__________________
I'm against ending blackness. I believe that everyone has a right to be black, it's a choice, and I support that.

~Steven Colbert

Last edited by Gilda; 10-15-2006 at 04:58 PM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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