Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post - Jimmy Carter working to weakening the USA

roachboy · 09-17-2006, 09:44 AM

mojo:

because this administration has chosen to use the discourse of morality to justify its actions, how it is perceived internationally as a viable "moral agent" if you like is fundamental.
the legitimacy not only of the administration's action, but of the administration itself rests on it.
this was a choice the bush people made in the period immediately after 9/11/2001--and they have been consistent in their obsessive use of this language.
so the problems that their actions create for them are fundamentally their own fault for choosing a strategy for marketing their ideology that is, quite simply, extremely vulnerable. the illusion of strength of purpose it provides is a very thin and tenous one.
while the discourse of morality may appeal to the far right christian set, in the real world, it is a very risky tack to adopt.

oddly enough, this lesson was also learned by the carter administration, but in a very different context with a very different (and to my mind far more sane) agenda behind it. maybe that is an underlying reason why the far right seems to be having fun the past couple days in excoriating carter--he threatens the illusion of monopoly on morality that the bush people like to claim for themselves.

i think colin powell is right about the implications of the practices associated with the bushwar in its most general sense for the legitmacy of the united states as an international actor. i think mcain and warner are right as well.

the bush administration is the worst enemy the discourses of democracy and morality have had for some time.
the arguments that you have been making, which are all based on raison d'etat, overlook what machiavelli was very clear about: if you are going to wrap your actions in claims to morality, you cannot in fact be moral---but you MUST maintain the appearance of consistency, otherwise you will be reviled.
and even you would have to admit that, at this juncture, the bush administration is reviled.
everywhere.
you might not like it, but you can't deny it.

this points to a significant political problem that you cannot simply wish away.
there is little to be done after a loss of legitimacy.

09-17-2006, 09:44 AM	#42 (permalink)
roachboy Super Moderator Location: essex ma	mojo: because this administration has chosen to use the discourse of morality to justify its actions, how it is perceived internationally as a viable "moral agent" if you like is fundamental. the legitimacy not only of the administration's action, but of the administration itself rests on it. this was a choice the bush people made in the period immediately after 9/11/2001--and they have been consistent in their obsessive use of this language. so the problems that their actions create for them are fundamentally their own fault for choosing a strategy for marketing their ideology that is, quite simply, extremely vulnerable. the illusion of strength of purpose it provides is a very thin and tenous one. while the discourse of morality may appeal to the far right christian set, in the real world, it is a very risky tack to adopt. oddly enough, this lesson was also learned by the carter administration, but in a very different context with a very different (and to my mind far more sane) agenda behind it. maybe that is an underlying reason why the far right seems to be having fun the past couple days in excoriating carter--he threatens the illusion of monopoly on morality that the bush people like to claim for themselves. i think colin powell is right about the implications of the practices associated with the bushwar in its most general sense for the legitmacy of the united states as an international actor. i think mcain and warner are right as well. the bush administration is the worst enemy the discourses of democracy and morality have had for some time. the arguments that you have been making, which are all based on raison d'etat, overlook what machiavelli was very clear about: if you are going to wrap your actions in claims to morality, you cannot in fact be moral---but you MUST maintain the appearance of consistency, otherwise you will be reviled. and even you would have to admit that, at this juncture, the bush administration is reviled. everywhere. you might not like it, but you can't deny it. this points to a significant political problem that you cannot simply wish away. there is little to be done after a loss of legitimacy. __________________ a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite Last edited by roachboy; 09-17-2006 at 09:47 AM..