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lindalove · 08-20-2006, 08:05 AM

I don't think any animal or person is born an asshole. However, animals don't use money, poverty, greed, drugs, alcohol, their past, sexual orientation, political interests, ect...to act like assholes. A dogs reasons to act like an ass has no connection to why people act likes asses except for possibly the owner holding the other end of the leash.

Most dogs can be turned around with good training. Notice I didn't say all of them because there are dogs out there that cannot be for one reason or another. Something else that most people are not willing to do. How many people are known to make a 360 degree turn in their behavior over the course of a few weeks to a few months? Not many. Dogs don't think like people. This is a good thing!!

How many female dogs have you see lately get into a cat-fight because one dog has a better coat than an other? How many male dogs have you seen farting at the water dish while confiding in each other that it's only acceptable for guys to do such things. If females dogs were do to that, certainly they must be butch. Need I say more?

Since pitbulls have been mentioned on more than one occasion on this thread, what is a pitbull? Better yet, lets get away from the term "pitbull" and call this breed what is really is for a second... A Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

When I think of a terrier regrardless of breed, a number of adjectives come to mind. Hyper, stubborn, scrappy, bullheaded, tempermental and will use a person like a door mat if the human onwer is stupid enough to allow it.

The only terriers that are kind of mellow and dare I say lazy are Airdales. If allowed to do so, they become more like a curly coated rug if given the chance. Besides the Airdale, Pitbulls just happen to be one of the larger breeds of terrier. Another breed of terrier which is considerably smaller but can walk the fine line is the Boston Terrier. They tend to act more like a pug even though they orignally come from Bulldog bloodlines.

Now I'm going to disagree as well, as just because Pitbulls haven't been used for fighting since the 1800's, that doesn't mean that the other character traits of the breed has disappeared as they are still a terrrier. If you put any terrrier is sheeps clothing, it is still a terrier.

Can the scrappy trait be removed by training? No. Since dog owners tend to gravitate to dogs that act like themselves, will a stubborn, bullheaded owner listen to a certified dog trainer that has been in the business for years that specializes in dog aggression issues? Most likely not because they feel that there is nothing wrong with their dog.

All of those "flaws" need to be dealt with once the animal is old enough to walk. There have been disagreements on here on when it's appropiate to bring a puppy to a trainer, but as it has also been said that a dog trainer really doesn't train the dog, instead they train the owner how to deal with their pet. Training does not remove the problem per say, but it does give the owner firm ground to stand on when their pet decides to act up somehow through problem solving.

Dog trainers that do not include the owners should not be in the business that they are in as the owner is left completely clueless. The trainer feeds off of this ignorance and rips the unknowing owner off. So technically a dog trainer is really a person trainer, but they would never make any money if they changed the "dog trainer" title to what it really is. People don't want to be trained and if they are, they don't want to know about it. Dogs don't have hang-ups with honesty or titles.

It takes a firm hand to own a dog with the qualities that I mentioned above. It isn't just terrriers that can be like that. My mother's shiba is as scrappy as they come. One minute she'll love a person, but on the fly she can completely change her attitude and come running at you as if you were going to do some serious bodily harm to her because you simply want her to go outside when she doesn't want to.

People think the term firm hand equals abuse and it doesn't. All it means if that when a dog is misbehaving and they are instructed to do something else, they are expected to follow the command that was given as there are consequences to be had if it isn't. Such consequences include a fast snap of a training collar and a firm "No!" If the animal still refuses to sit as an example, there are non-abusive ways to make an dog sit. Once the dog butt is firmly planted on the ground, praise is given and all is well until next time.

If the owner holds a grudge about the situation, it's the owners problem. Dogs don't think "I'm sorry Dad for being a putz at the vets. I spent too much time playing with the boys in the neighborhood last night so I'm overtired and crotchedy, hence my poor behavior."

It all still boils down to education. If a person wants a dog that is known to be scrappy, they should know what they are getting into first, but ignorance is bliss with far too many pet owners.

Can a pitbull live a peaceful life without ever having an issue with anybody? Yes, but as I've already said, it's up to the owners to make sure they stay on top of that dog just because it's a terrier. The owner doesn't need to play the alpha role like what can be seen in wolves, they just need to have the knowledge and understanding of what a terrier is really about.

If said owners are not willing to do that but still want a dog, they should be looking for a breed that is less of a challange. What people put into their dogs is what they get out of them. If a owner sets high standards, the dog may not always meet them, but will be better behaved than a monster dog that is allowed to terrorize the neighborhood.

Dogs don't live to be mans best friend. Dogs will test and challenge it's owner(s) at some point. An educated owner will know what to do about it, the arrogent owner will say "That's just how the dog is!" A huge difference and it shows as otherwise there wouldn't be such thing as a "Bad Dog List".

08-20-2006, 08:05 AM	#35 (permalink)
lindalove Registered User	I don't think any animal or person is born an asshole. However, animals don't use money, poverty, greed, drugs, alcohol, their past, sexual orientation, political interests, ect...to act like assholes. A dogs reasons to act like an ass has no connection to why people act likes asses except for possibly the owner holding the other end of the leash. Most dogs can be turned around with good training. Notice I didn't say all of them because there are dogs out there that cannot be for one reason or another. Something else that most people are not willing to do. How many people are known to make a 360 degree turn in their behavior over the course of a few weeks to a few months? Not many. Dogs don't think like people. This is a good thing!! How many female dogs have you see lately get into a cat-fight because one dog has a better coat than an other? How many male dogs have you seen farting at the water dish while confiding in each other that it's only acceptable for guys to do such things. If females dogs were do to that, certainly they must be butch. Need I say more? Since pitbulls have been mentioned on more than one occasion on this thread, what is a pitbull? Better yet, lets get away from the term "pitbull" and call this breed what is really is for a second... A Staffordshire Bull Terrier. When I think of a terrier regrardless of breed, a number of adjectives come to mind. Hyper, stubborn, scrappy, bullheaded, tempermental and will use a person like a door mat if the human onwer is stupid enough to allow it. The only terriers that are kind of mellow and dare I say lazy are Airdales. If allowed to do so, they become more like a curly coated rug if given the chance. Besides the Airdale, Pitbulls just happen to be one of the larger breeds of terrier. Another breed of terrier which is considerably smaller but can walk the fine line is the Boston Terrier. They tend to act more like a pug even though they orignally come from Bulldog bloodlines. Now I'm going to disagree as well, as just because Pitbulls haven't been used for fighting since the 1800's, that doesn't mean that the other character traits of the breed has disappeared as they are still a terrrier. If you put any terrrier is sheeps clothing, it is still a terrier. Can the scrappy trait be removed by training? No. Since dog owners tend to gravitate to dogs that act like themselves, will a stubborn, bullheaded owner listen to a certified dog trainer that has been in the business for years that specializes in dog aggression issues? Most likely not because they feel that there is nothing wrong with their dog. All of those "flaws" need to be dealt with once the animal is old enough to walk. There have been disagreements on here on when it's appropiate to bring a puppy to a trainer, but as it has also been said that a dog trainer really doesn't train the dog, instead they train the owner how to deal with their pet. Training does not remove the problem per say, but it does give the owner firm ground to stand on when their pet decides to act up somehow through problem solving. Dog trainers that do not include the owners should not be in the business that they are in as the owner is left completely clueless. The trainer feeds off of this ignorance and rips the unknowing owner off. So technically a dog trainer is really a person trainer, but they would never make any money if they changed the "dog trainer" title to what it really is. People don't want to be trained and if they are, they don't want to know about it. Dogs don't have hang-ups with honesty or titles. It takes a firm hand to own a dog with the qualities that I mentioned above. It isn't just terrriers that can be like that. My mother's shiba is as scrappy as they come. One minute she'll love a person, but on the fly she can completely change her attitude and come running at you as if you were going to do some serious bodily harm to her because you simply want her to go outside when she doesn't want to. People think the term firm hand equals abuse and it doesn't. All it means if that when a dog is misbehaving and they are instructed to do something else, they are expected to follow the command that was given as there are consequences to be had if it isn't. Such consequences include a fast snap of a training collar and a firm "No!" If the animal still refuses to sit as an example, there are non-abusive ways to make an dog sit. Once the dog butt is firmly planted on the ground, praise is given and all is well until next time. If the owner holds a grudge about the situation, it's the owners problem. Dogs don't think "I'm sorry Dad for being a putz at the vets. I spent too much time playing with the boys in the neighborhood last night so I'm overtired and crotchedy, hence my poor behavior." It all still boils down to education. If a person wants a dog that is known to be scrappy, they should know what they are getting into first, but ignorance is bliss with far too many pet owners. Can a pitbull live a peaceful life without ever having an issue with anybody? Yes, but as I've already said, it's up to the owners to make sure they stay on top of that dog just because it's a terrier. The owner doesn't need to play the alpha role like what can be seen in wolves, they just need to have the knowledge and understanding of what a terrier is really about. If said owners are not willing to do that but still want a dog, they should be looking for a breed that is less of a challange. What people put into their dogs is what they get out of them. If a owner sets high standards, the dog may not always meet them, but will be better behaved than a monster dog that is allowed to terrorize the neighborhood. Dogs don't live to be mans best friend. Dogs will test and challenge it's owner(s) at some point. An educated owner will know what to do about it, the arrogent owner will say "That's just how the dog is!" A huge difference and it shows as otherwise there wouldn't be such thing as a "Bad Dog List".