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Originally Posted by Cynthetiq
No, Iīm suggesting that people have something to STRIVE for. I know and understand the position you are taking. It is dear to me in ways you do not know and could not know.
I worked in NYC and lived in NJ in 1991. I made $4.35 working a small mom and pop garment factory working from 7am to 7am from Monday to Saturday. I got home every day around 8pm in a township that had blue laws so everything but grocery stores were closed on Sunday. In order to buy any work related clothing I had to travel to the next county or go into New York City.
When I first started working for this company I worked only 40 hours and asked for a raise, they suggested I wanted a raise and they said they had more hours to work available. Eventually they gave me a raise to $8/hr after I took on the duties of another gentleman that went on vacation and did both jobs, mine normal one and this new one. So my total hours increased even more since the original job I got hired to do I had to now do late at night.
I was sick or on vacation I did not get paid. If I had a doctors appointment I clocked out and did not get paid for those hours. There were many times I clocked out on Wednesday evening I had already worked 40 hours.
One day I got fed up with the whole thing and went to a career counselor. They tested me and had a potential job for me. Within 24 hours I had secured a new job doubling my total income. It was a corporate job, I stayed there until I closed the company after it was divested. I jumped from company to company until I landed where I am now. I have been with this corporation for 10 years now.
It took me a number of years NOT staying in the security of a particular job but taking risks that I did not want to but had to in order to better my lot. I know according to career counselors that I am underpaid since I have not yet gone above $100,000. But let me tell you, I am happy where I am. I have no stress. I get 3 weeks vacation a year, 2 weeks of sick days, summer fridays where from Labor day to Memorial day I get every other Friday off. I can take off early to go to doctorīs appointments. I get a good number of other perks, like a pension plan, bonus based on profit sharing, 401k matching. Many many other perks that I cannot even begin to list.
The moral here is that I could have stayed where I was like many other people at that garment company. I know many people still working there who have worked there for 25 years. I have surpassed many of them in income, but in happiness I could not say, because some of them equate security of the same place as something important to them.
I donīt have a college degree, I barely graduated from High School having to retake a science in summer school because I failed physics.
I believe that I wanted to have a better life, one better than what was just handed and given to me. I worked very hard for where I am, and will continue to do so. I resent anyone who isnīt willing to exert some effort to improve their lot in life and expect someone else to just divy it up for them.
I was laid off from my wonderful corporation, they gave me a severance package for 9 months. Looking for jobs there were few and far between, I ended up taking a pay cut that I know most people in poverty would never achieve. But I retrained and retooled my skills to make myself more desireable and marketable. I was eventually rehired back to the company because my skills fit the long term goals of the company something I prepared and worked hard for.
The mom and pop operation could not have ever provided me such a lifestyle. I could not have ever expected it. It would have been silly for me to think so. Just like I do not think that a CEO cannot provide me that lifestyle. I created it on my own with my own resources and my own blood, sweat, and tears, and sacrifices.
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That truly is commendable Cyn. But not everyone has the drive you do, so we should punish people for just being happy to have a job where they can afford to live decently?
I find the argument that "if one wants better they will strive for it" very degrading, judgemental and assuming that EVERYONE has the same oppurtunities, background etc. as the one who made it.
I don't buy that BS. Cyn you are a very intelligent man and what drives you may not drive someone else. It isn't he/she is lazy but life may have happened and he/she may have kids, made a mistake somewhere along the road (quit school, committed a crime when he was young, had a severe illness, poor credit, whatever etc.) where a decent job can't be had, and so on. Do you suggest these people get stuck in a job they cannot afford to live but cannot afford to quit either be punished with those low wages because they fucked up in their past and made a mistake and thus are not worthy to advance?
For every great moving up story like yours there are many more where the guy had a decent job, lost it and found there were no jobs out there that could pay him near the wage he made.... so he couldn't afford his car payment, mortgage, kids' college, etc.
As college tuitions skyrocket, aid decreases it is becoming harder and harder to get an education..... and then with student loans (both public and private because the gov't loans aren't enough anymore), working at a job that pays barely enough to make it is like slavery. Why? Because you are stuck there. You have bills and can't afford to quit. You are exhausted because you are salary working 50 hours (or trying to work 2 jobs because neither offers full time) in a stress filled job and sleep is unheard of, because of the stress and nightmares of work....... How do you tell someone to get out of that? How do you show someone there is a light at the end of the tunnel?
Because there are more and more like that than are like you...... people beaten down by the system. At least with better wages..... perhaps they can afford to take a few days off to look for a better job or find something better.
Maybe these scenarios are just in Ohio...... (I will say AZ had plenty of work but lousy wages)..... I don't know I can only go by what I see and what I know.... and I know people have drive or they don't.... it doesn't matter what they make, the drive is there or isn't.... but the system can wear a person down to the point they give up those dreams and the drive because the possibility to advance isn't there. For the people with no drive and happy to make a wage they can live on..... who is to say there is anything wrong with that? As long as they work 40 hours a week and are happy and make enough to live on I see no problem with that.
This whole, "Either you have a drive or you can't make a liveable wage" is BS. It an excuse to keep wages low and people living on credit, heavily indebted and it is not bettering society in anyway. If anything it is destroying society and widening ths gaps.