Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post

host · 04-30-2006, 03:26 AM

I prefaced what is contained as documentation of the holes in the flight 93 "heroes" propaganda, and the Moussouai prosecution, over at the politis forum, in the flight 93 poll thread:

Quote:

I've posted some research...excerpts from news reports and interviews, on the at TFP Paranoia forum, that seems to establish that Cheney labelled the flight 93 passengers as "heroes" moments after reports arrived at his bunker on 9/11, that flight 93 had crushed. It seems an odd and suspicious comment, unless a plan to turn those airline passengers into hero/martyrs had been pre-determined.

The folks making phone calls from flight 93 to "loved ones" (one fellow made four calls), were reported to be too chatty, and too tardy in ending their calls, to be available to "rush the cockpit" in time to match the newly released transcript of the flight 93 CVR. Lyz Glick, widow of "hero" Jeremy Glick, maintained that she informed him during their last phone call, that the south WTC tower had collapsed. That tower, the first to fall, collapsed at 9:59:04 am....one minute after the transcript shows that the "hijackers" were aware of the attempt by passengers to rush and open the cockpit door.

This does not take into account that Lyz Glick needed at least several moments to observe the televised collapse of the tower, during the emotion of what she says she believed to be the last conversation...ever....with her husband, Jeremy, and then explain what she saw to him....and then say a final goodbye.

The news reports show that, beginning with Cheney's on the spot declaration, the ball "got rolling" to convince us that those passengers are "heroes". The 9/11 Commission "report", the Moussaoui trial, preceded by a January, 2006 A&E TV movie, the release to the public of the voice recording (CVR), and the release to theaters of the new United 93 film, along with the books written by surviving relatives of the "heroes", (Both Lyn Glick and her father wrote books), counter details like my observation about account timeline discrepancies....and a report I included of testimony of FBI agent James M. Fitzgerald, conceding that there was no evidence of contact between Moussaoui and any of the 9/11 hijackers, and that the FBI knew for ten years before 9/11, that Al Qaeda was sending it's members to U.S. flight schools.

Why then, did the federal prosecutors emphasize previously undisclosed flight 93 CVR transcripts, recordings of WTC victims 9-1-1 calls for help, and photos of flight 93 crash debris, to attempt to convince a jury that Moussaoui should be sentenced to death?

I've also documented Rumsfeld referring to flight 93, in a 12/24/2004 speech, as having been, "shot down". I'm more comfortable than ever, the more that is disclosed about 9/11, concluding that most of what we "know" does not match the facts provided to us by those responsible for our nation's defense, and public safety.

Quote:

http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/wireSt...1835272&page=3
Transcript: United Flight 93 Cockpit Tape

(Page 3 of 4)

....09:57:55 (Is there something?)

09:57:57 (A fight?)

09:54:59 (Yeah?)

09:58:33 Unintelligible. (Let's go guys. Allah is greatest. Allah is greatest. Oh guys. Allah is greatest.)

09:58:41 Ugh.

09:58:43 Ugh.

09:58:44 (Oh Allah. Oh Allah. Oh the most gracious.)

09:58:47 Ugh. Ugh.

09:58:52 Stay back.

09:58:55 In the cockpit.

09:58:57 In the cockpit.

09:58:57 (They want to get in here. Hold, hold from the inside. Hold from the inside. Hold)........

In depth, Flight 93 phone call descriptions in this Newsweek Report:

Quote:

http://www.dailyherald.com/special/w...intID=37225488
The full story of Flight 93
By Karen Breslau, Eleanor Clift and Evan Thomas Newsweek
Posted on 11/30/2001

Newsweek Special Report:

........Then he began asking more immediate questions. Was it true, as other passengers were saying, that planes had crashed into the World Trade Center? Lyz said it was. "Is that where we're going, too?" he wondered aloud. "Or are they just going to blow it up?" Lyz said she doubted that the target was the World Trade Center; there was nothing left to crash into.
Lyz asked if the hijackers had machine guns. "No machine guns, just knives," Jeremy answered..............

Quote:

http://911review.org/93/93/index.html

....9:58 a.m. Todd Beamer ends his long phone call saying that they plan "to jump" the hijacker in the back who has the bomb 9:58 a.m. CeeCee Lyles says to her husband, "Aah, it feels like the plane's going down."
What's that?" She replies, "I think they're going to do it. They're forcing their way into the cockpit (an alternate version says, "They're getting ready to force their way into the cockpit")
http://billstclair.com/911timeline/main/flight93.html ......

Quote:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/...nbc091401.html
A Heroic Last Stand

Family of Jeremy Glick recounts his final moments on United Flight 93

Dateline NBC
September 14, 2001
http://www.msnbc.com/news/629077.asp

...A 20-MINUTE CALL

"My son called from Westchester, said, 'Turn the TV on,'" says Richard. "I turned the TV on, and the crashes were occurring. I just had a gut feeling that Jeremy's up in the air, but hopefully he's gone. And Lyz was up now, and the news was going on. And I was turning TVs off. I didn't want Lizzie to worry that something was going on. I think she knew, or maybe she didn't want me to worry. And then the phone rings at about a quarter to 10. And it's Jeremy. My wife picked up my phone, and she said, 'Jeremy, thank God, we're so worried.' And he said, 'It's bad news.' And he said, 'Let me talk to Lyz.' And that's when they started talking."

What time in the flight did they get the call? "He said they had been up for about an hour, and there was some very bad men that had come onto the plane," says Lyz. "I'm not sure how long they had been up before the plane was hijacked. But he said that the men had a bomb and they had a
knife. He said that they were Arabic-looking men. I think he said they were wearing red headbands. The description said that there were three of them. He was very surprised that these people could have boarded the plane."

Did he say that they were flying the plane? "He didn't say anything," says Lyz. "I asked him if the pilots had been in contact with them to tell them what was going on, and he said that no contact had been made by the pilots. It seems that the men had taken over the plane and had moved everyone to the back of the plane and kind of left them there."

Jeremy told her he was calling from the plane air phone. It was a conversation Lyz says lasted for more than 20 minutes. So he was free to talk? Or was he trying to speak surreptitiously? "He was free to talk to me,"
says Lyz. "I was a little bit, I think surprised by the aura of what was going on, on the plane.

I was surprised by how calm it seemed in the background. I didn't hear any screaming. I didn't hear any noises. I didn't hear any commotion. It almost didn't make sense to me, you know, that such a terrible thing could be happening, yet what I was hearing in the background and in his voice was not as bad as what was really happening on that flight."

There was no hysteria on the ground, either. Lyz's mom had the wit to dial 911 from another line. Authorities patched into the call. "And we ran and got the cell phone and dialed 911 and tried to get a link where Lizzie was
talking to Jeremy and Joanne was talking to the state police and questions were going back and forth," says Richard.

Who exactly was on the other end of the phone? "The New York State Trooper barrack," says Richard. "I'm not sure - maybe in Kingston, New York, or something like that where the 911 call routed."

Were they asking Jeremy questions, too? "They were listening," says Lyz. "They had not been able to - I had heard them tap in, but they were not able to ask questions."

He said there was a bomb? "Yes," says Lyz.......

......FORMULATING A PLAN

So there was hope that he could overcome it. In fact, Jeremy and two other men were hatching a plan in the back of that 757, now a little more than a half hour from the nation's capitol. It was a suicide mission, in a way - not to take lives but to save them. Another passenger, Thomas Burnett, told his wife by cell phone that three of them were talking about "rushing the hijackers."

Jeremy told Lyz they were going to take a vote. "He was asking me, 'I need some advice - what to do?'" she says. "'Should we, you know, we're talking about attacking these men, what should I do?' And, you know, I was scared about giving him the wrong information. I didn't want to do something wrong and have something terrible happen, and so I asked him if they were armed. And he said he had seen knives. But there were no guns. And then I finally just decided at that instant that, 'Honey, you need to do it'.

"And then he joked. He's like, 'OK, I have my butter knife from breakfast.' You know, this was totally like Jeremy. And then he said to me, 'You know, I'm going to leave the phone here. Stay on the line, I'll be back.' And then I gave the phone to my dad because I didn't want to hear what had happened. And I just prayed, I just sat there and prayed."

Richard listened.......

.....The last thing Lyz heard her husband say was to stay on the line. But she couldn't bear to listen and handed the phone to her father, who did.
"There was no noise for several minutes," says Richard. "And then there was screams, screams in the background and so I said, 'Well, they're doing it.' Another minute, seemed like eternity, but another minute, minute and a half, and then there was another set of screams. And it was muffled. It was almost as if a roller coaster, the noise that you hear. Then there was
nothing.".......

Quote:

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3080114/
Lyz Glick’s courage
Staying strong to honor her husband’s memory
Aug. 20 (2002)

......When he called again, she could see lower Manhattan engulfed in fire and smoke on television. He was looking at a hijacker with what he said was a bomb strapped to his waist. Lyz Glick: “He said, ‘Lyz, I need to know something. One of the other passengers had talked to their spouse and he had told me, said that they were crashing planes into the World Trade

Center,’ and was this true. And I said, ‘You need to be strong, but yes, they are doing that.’” She didn’t tell him everything she was seeing. As they talked, another plane crashed into the Pentagon. And then the first tower collapsed.

He said one passenger was already dead and the others were plotting to rush the cockpit as a last chance to live or save other lives. While it was unspoken, it was understood, this was goodbye.........

Quote:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/sept11/...tcsurvival.htm

12/20/2001 - Updated 05:37 PM ET

For many on Sept. 11, survival was no accident

By Dennis Cauchon, USA TODAY

.......Columbia University scientists recorded the precise time of the attacks on a seismograph connected to an atomic clock. The north tower was struck at 8:46:26 a.m., two to five minutes earlier than in most accounts. The impact registered magnitude-0.9 on the seismograph, equal to a small earthquake. The south tower was hit at 9:02:54 a.m. By Stan Honda, AFP
A survivor takes refuge after the collapse of the World Trade Center towers.
The south tower collapsed first, at 9:59:04 a.m. The north tower fell at 10:28:31 a.m..........

Quote:

http://discoverychannelasia.com/flig...93/index.shtml
Timeline of events on Flight 93 - Tuesday, September 11, 2001

........9:57a.m. Todd Beamer ends his conversation with Lisa Jefferson, but the call stays connected, and Lisa hears his statement "Let's roll." Passengers likely begin attempts to take back control of Flight 93. The cockpit voice recorder captures the sound of a passenger assault
muffled by the cockpit door.

9:58a.m. Passenger Edward Felt places a call to a 911 operator in Westmoreland, Pennsylvania. It is the only known connected call to emergency services. Flight Attendant CeeCee Lyles reaches her husband, Lorne, and they say a prayer together. She tells him she has been boiling water to throw at the hijackers to try and regain control of the plane. She tells him that everyone is running to first class and she has to go. Ziad Jarrah, the hijacker pilot, begins to roll the plane to the left and right, attempting to knock passengers off balance. 10:00a.m. At approximately this time, Bill Wright and Holli Joiner are flying in a small plane
mapping agricultural land over western Pennsylvania, and are descending in response to Cleveland Center’s orders to land. At about 7,000 feet, they see Flight 93 approximately 1,000 feet above them. They later reported seeing its wings rock back and forth. The cockpit voice recorder captures the hijackers discussing when to "…finish it off." A passenger voice can be heard
saying "…in the cockpit. If we don't we'll die." Another yells "Roll it!" Three F-16 fighter jets scrambled from Langley Air Force Base in response to earlier attacks arrive over Washington around this time. The pilots are still unaware that Flight 93 has even been hijacked.

10:01a.m. Andrew Garcia makes a call to his wife, Dorothy. He only has time to say "Dorothy" before he is cut off.

10:02a.m. The cockpit voice recorder captures the hijackers saying "Pull it down! Pull it down!" and "Allah is the greatest." 10:03a.m. Flight 93 crashes into an empty field near Shanksville, Pennsylvania. Paula Pluta of
Stonycreek Township saw the plane crash behind some trees about 1,500 yards from her home. She is the first person to report the crash to emergency services.

Quote:

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLI...ney/index.html
Cheney recalls taking charge from bunker

September 11, 2002 Posted: 9:51 PM EDT (0151 GMT)

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- As horrified Americans watched the terror attacks of September 11, 2001, unfold on their television sets, Vice President Dick Cheney directed the U.S. government's response from an emergency bunker.......

........After the planes struck the twin towers, a third took a chunk out of the Pentagon. Cheney then heard a report that a plane over Pennsylvania was heading for Washington. A military assistant asked Cheney twice for authority to shoot it down.

"The vice president said yes again," remembered Josh Bolton, deputy White House chief of staff. "And the aide then asked a third time. He said, 'Just confirming, sir, authority to engage?' And the vice president -- his voice got a little annoyed then -- said, 'I said yes.'" It was a rare flash of anger from a man who knew he was setting the tone at a White House in crisis.

"I think there was an undertone of anger there. But it's more a matter of determination. You don't want to let your anger overwhelm your judgment in a moment like this," Cheney said. Word came that Flight 93 crashed in Pennsylvania. Aides frantically called the White House to find out whether a military jet had shot it down.

"The vice president was a little bit ahead of us," said Eric Edelman, Cheney's national security advisor. "He said sort of softly and to nobody in particular, 'I think an act of heroism just took place on that plane.'"......

Quote:

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0.../nfcnn.01.html
NEWS FROM CNN

Surprise Trip for Donald Rumsfeld; Interview With Brigadier General James Marks; Christian in Iraq

Aired December 24, 2004 - 12:00 ET

........(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: And to change that way of living, would strike at the very essence of our country.

And I think all of us have a sense if we imagine the kind of world we would face if the people who bombed the mess hall in Mosul, or the people who did the bombing in Spain, or the people who attacked the United States in New York, shot down the plane over Pennsylvania and attacked the Pentagon, the people who cut off peoples' heads on television to intimidate, to frighten -- indeed the word "terrorized" is just that. Its purpose is to terrorize, to alter behavior, to make people be something other than that which they want to be.

And that is exactly what we cannot allow to happen..........

Quote:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...012901118.html
A& E's 'Flight 93': From Tragedy to Tripe, Nonstop

By Tom Shales
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, January 30, 2006; Page C01

Who will profit the most from exploiting the obscene tragedy of Flight 93? In the days and weeks following the terrorist attacks on America in September 2001, it seemed unthinkable that even the sleaziest producers, Hollywood studios or TV networks would attempt to exploit any aspect of a nightmare that the nation had witnessed in horror as it occurred, especially one that left a scar so deep it may never heal.

But we were naive. It wasn't that long before CBS and HBO aired documentaries about the tragedy -- both produced, it must be said, with great restraint and dignity. The farther we get from the date of the tragedy, however, and the more time that passes, the less likely such qualities will
be evident in any films made about it.

Such is the case with the A&E Network's "Flight 93" airing tonight at 9 -- the second TV movie dramatizing what happened on a United Airlines flight from Newark to San Francisco that was to be the fourth of four planes involved in the 9/11 attacks; the terrorists' destination in this case was probably the Capitol or the White House.

In addition, there have been published reports that a theatrical movie about Flight 93 will be ready by next summer, the peak moviegoing period of the year....

Quote:

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_437477.html
Rumsfeld honors Flight 93 heroes
By Paul Peirce
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Tuesday, March 28, 2006

........The Sept. 11 Commission Report said the hijackers crashed Flight 93 as passengers tried to take control of the cockpit from al-Qaida terrorists.

"This is so much more personal. ... I've already been to the others and have wanted to come here because it's also such an important site. It's important to pay respect to these heroes," Rumsfeld said..........

Quote:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...030600781.html
Moussaoui Unfazed as 9/11 Attacks Detailed
Defendant Smiles as Prosecutor Describes Doomed Flight During Death Penalty Trial

By Jerry Markon and Timothy Dwyer
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, March 8, 2006; Page A07

........Prosecutors began building their case yesterday by barely mentioning the defendant, instead laying out what they learned during the broader Sept. 11 investigation. Known as PENTTBOM, the 9/11 probe initially involved virtually the entire FBI, at least 10,000 agents, FBI agent James M. Fitzgerald testified.

Fitzgerald offered minute details of how the hijackers planned and financed the attacks while moving freely around the United States, under their own names, after they started arriving in 2000. Most of the information had emerged previously in media accounts or the report of the independent commission that investigated the 9/11 attacks.

Under cross-examination by defense attorney Edward B. MacMahon Jr., Fitzgerald acknowledged that there was no evidence of any contact between Moussaoui and the hijackers. Moussaoui's role in the plot remains unclear, and prosecutors have said they do not intend to prove his precise
mission. But he took a series of actions before Sept. 11 that closely mirrored those of the hijackers, including buying two knives and taking flying lessons.

MacMahon also elicited testimony that the FBI knew in the early 1990s that al-Qaeda was sending pilots to U.S. flight schools, including the Oklahoma school where Moussaoui trained nearly a decade later. FBI special agent Michael Anticev testified that investigators thought the trained pilots would work only within bin Laden's organization..............

Through the saturation of our sensibilities from four years of government sponsored, fear filled propaganda, we've arrived at a point that our DOJ is powerful and arrogant enough to maintain that we, the people, can be prohibited from access to information that the DOJ prosecutors have made available to an accused criminal who they say is a member of Al Qaeda who conspired to attack us on 9/11!

Quote:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/...n1482302.shtml
Notebook: Moussaoui Trial 'Hail Mary'

ALEXANDRIA, Va., April 7, 2006

.......Basically, the lawyers representing two groups of 9/11 victim plaintiffs in two large civil lawsuits in New York, having been made aware of TSA attorney Carla Martin's alleged "unacceptable collusion" with the airline-industry defendants in their case, are asking Judge Brinkema for access to materials turned over by the government to the Moussaoui defense team.

(Martin's discussions with prospective aviation witnesses almost derailed the Moussaoui prosecution when she was accused of having violated Judge Brinkema's orders.).........

.....A Justice Department lawyer from the court in New York protested that the victims are seeking to go around the judicial process. Since the Transportation Security Administration issued a "final order" denying the plaintiffs access to SSI ("sensitive security information" i.e., non-classified info), the proper recourse is to appeal to a higher court, not come down to a trial court and seek criminal defense discovery. It was at that point that Brinkema seemed to start turning: "It's quite extraordinary that TSA has a tougher policy on disclosure than the CIA, FBI, and NSA," she remarked. "It took a little browbeating," but the court got documents from them. "What puts TSA in a higher category?"

The Justice Department lawyer, Beth Goldman, seemed to realize the rug was slowly being pulled out from under her. The TSA made a final decision that civil litigation is not where this material is going to be used, she protested.

But Judge Brinkema seemed to have heard enough. Stating that she'd take the case under advisement, but would grant the Motion to Intervene, she proclaimed: "I've always been troubled by the degree to which our government keeps thing secret from the American people. In this court

case, I've often been surprised by the amount of things that are kept from the public. Even my own orders have been classified!"........