Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post - Tomorrow's games, designed by players as they play

robbdn · 02-24-2006, 09:37 AM

Deep breath... this is going to be a long one...

I think this thread so far really illustrates the full potential for this gaming concept. Will Wright will probably make a fun and interesting game, but is it really going to revolutionize gaming? I don't think it will.

There is a reason that when anybody mentions user-created mods, there are a handful of games that spring to mind. For my purposes, we'll take Valve's work, which arguably has the most well-known mod community. There's a reason for this. Valve focuses on creating a fully-realized gaming experience from their own minds, nothing else, and then says to the community that if we can do this, so can you, using our tools. When one plays through any of the Half-Life games, one is confronted with a creativity, in the art direction and in the gameplay, that comes directly from Valve's various individual minds. It inspires the player who wants to play MORE to continue that play by creating additional content for others to play with, just as Valve did. That's right, making good games is just a way of "playing with the players." These are people who love play in it's highest form, and I would argue that this higher form of play is an art, but that's a topic for another thread.

My point here is not to say that Will Wright is not one of these people who loves to play with players--he is--but I think he may have gone astray with this latest idea. When I'm deep in the game, it's more than just playing, it's part of understanding and relating to the team/individual that brought me said game. Spore will have that, for sure, but when my game is invaded by some aliens that come out of a drunk frat party I have reason to believe the game is going to crumble under its own weight. It's too much. Wright obviously has a vision to share, but how can it come through with an excess of user-created content, noise, to the game's true form? Obviously none of us have played this game, but this is the line of reasoning that leads me to my skepticism. At the risk of sounding elitist (it's a risk I'm willing to take) when we have nothing but user-content, we cannot play with the minds that brought us the game amidst the noise of those who cannot play as well as others. Games are always fun for them, but more as an expression of their own stupidity realized in-game as opposed to an appreciation of the creative process of play. You more commonly know them as the cheaters, and so on.

That said, I think Spore and the Xbox Live Marketplace are two completely separate issues. But when Microsoft's bad boy goes with Will Wright to talk about games, these issues will be linked. I agree with guthmund when it comes to XBL Marketplace, for the most part. The homebrew and indie gaming scene are both alive and kicking, and beautiful things. They are communities of people who love play for its own sake, and work at playing for nothing more than the reward of play itself. The fact is, though, that these people do have to eat, and pay their mortgages/rent. XBL Marketplace finally offers an easily accessible direct-to-market path for indie developers, which is fantastic.... it also means that Microsoft profits everytime somebody enjoys the fruits of a dedicated game-maker's art, which tastes sour to say the least. I would not be surprised, however, if these indie communities continued to offer their work for free to PC and homebrew users on the "free" internet and solicit donations, while raising revenue for food and future products by selling to Xbox 360 users who aren't aware of these communities on the net. Or maybe I don't understand how XBL really works. I'll have to do some more research on it. Any thoughts?

02-24-2006, 09:37 AM	#4 (permalink)
robbdn Crazy	Deep breath... this is going to be a long one... I think this thread so far really illustrates the full potential for this gaming concept. Will Wright will probably make a fun and interesting game, but is it really going to revolutionize gaming? I don't think it will. There is a reason that when anybody mentions user-created mods, there are a handful of games that spring to mind. For my purposes, we'll take Valve's work, which arguably has the most well-known mod community. There's a reason for this. Valve focuses on creating a fully-realized gaming experience from their own minds, nothing else, and then says to the community that if we can do this, so can you, using our tools. When one plays through any of the Half-Life games, one is confronted with a creativity, in the art direction and in the gameplay, that comes directly from Valve's various individual minds. It inspires the player who wants to play MORE to continue that play by creating additional content for others to play with, just as Valve did. That's right, making good games is just a way of "playing with the players." These are people who love play in it's highest form, and I would argue that this higher form of play is an art, but that's a topic for another thread. My point here is not to say that Will Wright is not one of these people who loves to play with players--he is--but I think he may have gone astray with this latest idea. When I'm deep in the game, it's more than just playing, it's part of understanding and relating to the team/individual that brought me said game. Spore will have that, for sure, but when my game is invaded by some aliens that come out of a drunk frat party I have reason to believe the game is going to crumble under its own weight. It's too much. Wright obviously has a vision to share, but how can it come through with an excess of user-created content, noise, to the game's true form? Obviously none of us have played this game, but this is the line of reasoning that leads me to my skepticism. At the risk of sounding elitist (it's a risk I'm willing to take) when we have nothing but user-content, we cannot play with the minds that brought us the game amidst the noise of those who cannot play as well as others. Games are always fun for them, but more as an expression of their own stupidity realized in-game as opposed to an appreciation of the creative process of play. You more commonly know them as the cheaters, and so on. That said, I think Spore and the Xbox Live Marketplace are two completely separate issues. But when Microsoft's bad boy goes with Will Wright to talk about games, these issues will be linked. I agree with guthmund when it comes to XBL Marketplace, for the most part. The homebrew and indie gaming scene are both alive and kicking, and beautiful things. They are communities of people who love play for its own sake, and work at playing for nothing more than the reward of play itself. The fact is, though, that these people do have to eat, and pay their mortgages/rent. XBL Marketplace finally offers an easily accessible direct-to-market path for indie developers, which is fantastic.... it also means that Microsoft profits everytime somebody enjoys the fruits of a dedicated game-maker's art, which tastes sour to say the least. I would not be surprised, however, if these indie communities continued to offer their work for free to PC and homebrew users on the "free" internet and solicit donations, while raising revenue for food and future products by selling to Xbox 360 users who aren't aware of these communities on the net. Or maybe I don't understand how XBL really works. I'll have to do some more research on it. Any thoughts? __________________ I'm swimming in the digital residue of a media-drenched world. It's too cold.