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Originally Posted by shakran
Then I suppose we can say the same here? Carrying a sword isn't considered because the government is held in proper check by an armed populace? Kinda convenient doncha think?
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I'm not following you here. How do you think we have our government in proper check when they've been able to do the things they've done for the last 30 years?
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Originally Posted by shakran
And if you search the right threads in here you'll see that I've always advocated a MUCH tougher driver education, training, and licensing system. I agree with you that it's far too easy to get permission to drive in this country, and far too many people die as a result.
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Thank you for at least being consistent. Far too many people are not.
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Originally Posted by shakran
Well hell I can make an IED without having a gun. And since guns are useless against what the military has, why not just make a bunch of bombs if it becomes necessary.
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while IED's work great against armor, what about the troops? What about the politicians when we finally corner them?
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Originally Posted by shakran
Because the majority of people who own guns aren't interested in getting enough proper training to own them safely. If you carry a gun, safety procedures should be second nature. You should be able to hit the center ring nearly EVERY time. Otherwise you're risking someone else's life for your false sense of security.
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even police are not required to hit the center ring everytime. All that is required is a certain amount of points and thats it. It's also not a false sense of security. Guns prevent an
estimated 2.5 million crimes a year, or 6,849 every day. “Targeting Guns”, Dr. Gary Kleck, Criminologist, Florida State University, 1997. Also, Less than 1% of all gun homicides involve innocent bystanders. Sherman, Steele, Laufersweiler, Hoffer and Julian, “Stray bullets and ‘mushrooms’”, 1989, Journal of
Quantitative Criminology
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Originally Posted by shakran
that's not relevant. It's not because I don't know them. It's because they aren't proficient enough with something that, if misused, could accidentally kill me.
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If you don't know them, how do you know that they aren't proficient? tell me how thats not relevant? Can you tell me that I'm not proficient? You don't know me so I must not be but it might surprise you that I qualified pistol expert all of my 6 years in the marine corps. None of my neighbors know that I qualified as a marine though, just that I was in the marines. I also think you are making way more of a problem out of 'accidental' gun deaths than you should be about other causes, like vehicle accidents or pool drownings.
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Originally Posted by shakran
I can only assume you're referring to Waco with your first question. If so, that was wrong, and the administration, the attorney general, and the ATF have admitted they screwed up bigtime. It should never have happened.
But I do have to point out that, if the Branch Davidians had not been able to get guns, they wouldn't have been raided over their little arsenal.
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actually, waco wasn't what came to mind for me. I was thinking about other states, not just texas, but you could include waco if you like. when you point out that if the branch had been unable to get guns, what you're really pointing out is that we should all be disarmed, defenseless, and subject to government oppression, yet again.
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Originally Posted by shakran
And it just goes to prove my point again. These guys were armed to the teeth and yet they still all died. Why? Because with modern weaponry, citizens can no longer arm themselves sufficiently to ward off a modern army.
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If you'll remember, the DoJ had ALL the media labelling koresh and his followers 'an anti-government pshyco mob bent on destroying the federal government child molesting satan worshipping sacrificial ritual' etc. The propaganda that was disseminated was used by the feds to make sure that the people did NOT rise up. The BATF and DoJ, had the truth been allowed to come out, would have been overwhelmed by mobs of angry citizens. What good does a tank do against 100 rushing angry and armed people?