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roachboy · 02-14-2006, 07:36 AM

samcol:
if i encountered conservative pacifists who opposed capital punishment and favored redistribution of wealth to encourage a more equitable quality of life, then maybe i would see a way to at least start to take the "abortion=murder" arguments seriously--but i dont.
the position you claim i should "take seriously" is inconsistent with the range of other views on questions pertaining to life and/or quality of life: so it is a political tweak, a way of framing this question so as (1) to lure the far right evangelical community under the republican ideology tent (ew..) and (2) to frame away the real issue, which i outlined above--because, and only because, framed in that way, the right cannot win.

if you read the post carefully, you would see that i do not view the question of the legality of abortion as obviating the questions that might arise for individuals about the morality of the procedure. people are not forced to have abortions simply because they are legal: nothing changes about the questions that might arise simply because the procedure is safe. so you see one of the two reasons i do not do this debate: anti-choice folk systematically distort the arguments of their opponents--they operate with an almost unbelievably patronizing view of all of us when they claim that keeping abortion legal obviates all questions as to the proceudre itself.

i have no patience on this question--and i am under no obligation whatsoever to take antichoice conservative views on the topic seriously--i dont----
my only obligation is social, that is to modulate when and how i enter into discussion with folk who, for whatever reason, do take that position seriously because--and only because--the discussion is not likely to go well.

you dont get to impose obligations, samcol.
so that's that.

02-14-2006, 07:36 AM	#15 (permalink)
roachboy Super Moderator Location: essex ma	samcol: if i encountered conservative pacifists who opposed capital punishment and favored redistribution of wealth to encourage a more equitable quality of life, then maybe i would see a way to at least start to take the "abortion=murder" arguments seriously--but i dont. the position you claim i should "take seriously" is inconsistent with the range of other views on questions pertaining to life and/or quality of life: so it is a political tweak, a way of framing this question so as (1) to lure the far right evangelical community under the republican ideology tent (ew..) and (2) to frame away the real issue, which i outlined above--because, and only because, framed in that way, the right cannot win. if you read the post carefully, you would see that i do not view the question of the legality of abortion as obviating the questions that might arise for individuals about the morality of the procedure. people are not forced to have abortions simply because they are legal: nothing changes about the questions that might arise simply because the procedure is safe. so you see one of the two reasons i do not do this debate: anti-choice folk systematically distort the arguments of their opponents--they operate with an almost unbelievably patronizing view of all of us when they claim that keeping abortion legal obviates all questions as to the proceudre itself. i have no patience on this question--and i am under no obligation whatsoever to take antichoice conservative views on the topic seriously--i dont---- my only obligation is social, that is to modulate when and how i enter into discussion with folk who, for whatever reason, do take that position seriously because--and only because--the discussion is not likely to go well. you dont get to impose obligations, samcol. so that's that. __________________ a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite Last edited by roachboy; 02-14-2006 at 07:42 AM..