Every guild I've been in just calls a wipe (for good reason) if he's not dead by the second submerge, since everyone's dead and no one can organize the second sons. I'm in lazy guilds.
That being said, you might hold off on Vael until you're a bit more confident you're ready for him. He's an immensely frustrating (and expensive) boss to wipe on, so if you don't think you have the FR or the DPS to take him down yet, I'd power through MC and ZG and Thorium Brotherhood rep for a while first to make sure everyone has proper gear, since it's not going to get any easier later in the instance.
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