Quote:
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Originally Posted by roachboy
i dont know, folks--while i think it important that the investigation of rove et al continue and that chages be filed where appropriate, i can't help but think that this scandal is a bit of a diversion, keeping attention away from real ones like this:
source: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?nav=hcmodule
the fallout so far:
source: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...110300422.html
from a couple hours ago, the administration's defense of itself:
sooner or later, this administration is going to be held to account for this.
i expect the defense from administration supporters that repeat the terms with which the bush squad had framed their war on phantoms since 2001--but i also imagine that defending this kind of activity is a stretch for all but the most ideologically driven conservatives. it seems to fly against absolutely everything that this "war on terror" was about..... |
rb, yer opener was too "effing" long. Haven't you learned by observing the "feedback" that I've received, here, to just keep it brief, and k.i.s.s,
Just a word to the wise.....don't let this happen to you:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=95107
Anyway, NS advisor, Stephen Hadley, held court yesterday, and provided these reassuring words. I can only react by wondering out loud if he thinks that all of us are as moronic as his boss is. I have digestive problems, and my doctor warned me against a steady diet of this bush shit. Who the f__k does Hadley expect will report about unacceptable treatment of detainees in locations that Hadley will neither confirm nor deny the existence of ? Who will these "incidents" be reported to? How will we know if an investigation takes place, whether anyone is held accountable, whether remedial action to fix this phantom, secret penal system actually takes place?
Hadley is asking us to just "trust", unquestioningly, Bush, Cheney, Goss, Rumsfeld, to do the "right thing" when "no one is looking". These war criminals have shown no inclination to do the "right thing" when everyone was looking, and I'm supposed to read what Hadley spews and accept it, trustingly?
The report that these criminals use former Soviet system prisons as secret detention facilities, is consistant with their Abu Ghraib "model".
Quote:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...051102-10.html
Press Briefing with National Security Advisor Stephen Hadley
James S. Brady Press Briefing Room
Fact sheetIn Focus: 2005 Summit of the Americas
3:00 P.M. EST
.........Q Can I ask you a quick one on another subject? Why does the administration feel it's necessary to maintain a network of secret detention centers around the world, out of sight of the Congress and the American people, and out of reach of American law and values?
MR. HADLEY: There have been some press reports this morning that have touched on that subject. And as you can appreciate, they raise some issues about possible intelligence operations. And as you know, we don't talk about intelligence operations from this podium.
Q Don't they also raise issue of our values and our reputation in the world?
MR. HADLEY: Right, and I think the President has been pretty clear on that, that while we have to do what we -- do what is necessary to defend the country against terrorists attacks and to win the war on terror,<b> the President has been very clear that we're going to do that in a way that is consistent with our values. And that is why he's been very clear that the United States will not torture.</b> The United States will conduct its activities in compliance with law and international obligations.
And in some of the issues involving detainees and the like, as you know, where there have been allegations that people have not met the standard the President has set, there have been investigations, and they have been of two forms. There are over a dozen investigations that have been done in the Department of Defense to find out what has been going on. Two things have happened as a result. There have been revisions of procedures and practices to ensure that the standard the President set is met; and then there have been investigations, prosecutions, and people punished for the failure to meet those standards. So we think that, consistent with the President's guidance, we are both protecting the country against the terrorists and doing it in a way that is consistent with our values and principles.
<b>Q If I could just press you on that, how do those self-correcting mechanisms that affirm our values and our laws, how do they work if the sites are secret to begin with?</b>
MR. HADLEY: Well, the fact that they are secret, <b>assuming there are such sites, does not mean that simply because something is -- and some people say that the test of your principles are what you do when no one is looking. And the President has insisted that whether it is in the public, or is in the private, the same principles will apply, and the same principles will be respected.</b> And to the extent people do not meet up, measure up to those principles, there will be accountability and responsibility. ...........
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Here is how the "trust us to do the right thing", even though we have a track record of waging illegal war of aggression, and a policy of torturing prisoners and protecting those who gave the orders to do so, plan to meet the "standard" accountability and responsibility that Hadley describes above. We plan not to hold CIA employees accountable, but to insure that they are exempt from accountability:
Quote:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...102500059.html
WHouse seeks to shield CIA from detainee rules: report
Reuters
Tuesday, October 25, 2005; 1:34 AM
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The White House has proposed that CIA employees be exempted from a measure barring cruel and degrading treatment of detainees in U.S. custody, The Washington Post reported on Tuesday.
The proposal states that the legislation approved by the U.S. Senate shall not apply to counterterrorism operations abroad or to operations conducted by "an element of the United States government" other than the Defense Department, the newspaper reported, citing two unidentified sources.
The report said Vice President Dick Cheney, with CIA Director Porter Goss present, handed the proposal to Sen. John McCain last Thursday.
McCain rejected the proposed exemption at the meeting with Cheney, the newspaper said, citing a government source who spoke on condition of anonymity.
A White House spokesman was not immediately available for comment.
McCain, an Arizona Republican who was tortured while a prisoner of war in Vietnam, led an effort in the Senate to establish the Army field manual as the standard for interrogations and bar cruel and degrading treatment of anyone in U.S. military custody.
Bucking a White House veto threat, the Senate overwhelmingly approved a bipartisan amendment to establish rules for detainee interrogation and treatment.
A number of lawmakers who supported the amendment have said abuses at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq and other U.S. military prisons have damaged the United States' international standing and risked retribution against U.S. soldiers who may be captured in the future.
The Bush administration said the measure would tie its hands as it fights terrorism and threatened to veto a $440 billion bill to fund the Pentagon if it contained the restrictions.
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One more time....if you vote for or support or apologize for these Bush/Cheney administration thugs, who deliberaely undermine the reputation and reliability of the USA, thus putting our troops in avoidable, addtional danger if they are ever held captive, and constantly strive to act in even more secret and unaccountable ways, at home and abroad, you yourself are complicit and culpable in crimes against humanity and against the United States and it's people.