pan6467

I can tell you around here exactly what they pay. As Hoover and other companies that paid decent wages close and layoff (with no intention of ever rehiring) the plastics companies all pay starting wages at between $6 and $7 and they go through the Temp companies so they don't pay benefits or overtime. And as far as temp - f/t getting better, doesn't happen. Take North Canton Plastics, they go through Ryan Temps. they pay $6.50 and after your 90 days when they are supposed to hire you as F/T they say there are no positions as they only keep 10 employees (including fronmt office secretaries) as F/T. But Ryan give you a raise of 25 cents 2 times a year.

As for GOJO, they pay $7 -$7.50 an hour depending on shift and offer benefits but the benefits come out of your paycheck so that $7 - $7.5 an hour turns into more like $6, try living on $240 a week with 3 kids.

Most places around here pay about $7 and how do you tell someone that made $18 at Hoover to pay their mortgage, car loan, kids upkeep on $11/hour less and that they are lazy asses who have no desire to advance in life because there are better jobs out there. How do you tell these people that are selling their houses and barely paying off their loans with the sale (because the housing market has fallen) that $7 is all they deserve.

How do you rebuild communities where the tax base has fallen to near zero? How do you expect schools and public safety to run?

IF there are areas paying higher wages on average I'd like to see what the cost of living is in that area.

You let the market determine the wages...... well then our wages are pennies on the dollar and we all go bankrupt.

There comes a time when things have gone too far to one side. Unions went too far now ownership has.

You say manufacturing jobs are a thing of the past? That's an excuse to put the burden of wages on the worker and not the owner.

Well where are those golden higher paying higher skilled jobs??? EB Games, Wal*Mart, Giant Eagle, or maybe the gas stations?

SEAVER (I capped so you wouldn't miss it),

I truly appreciate you admitting the stats and I appreciate your argument, but did your stats tell you the %ages of people living in those sections? My guess is that each lower section gained people each year.

And I do understand your side of the argument. Government should not be needed here BUT unfortunately it is, if owners would pay decent wages on their own then the keep government out would make sense.

I just don't understand how the rich can keep demanding lower taxes, yet supporting lower wages, when the tax burden is definitively being shifted onto them because of the lower wages.

What do we do with cities and states that have cut and cut and cut .... and still are in the red because the workers don't make the tax money. Start cutting emergency services? Start cutting wages to cops, teachers and firemen? Start outsourcing those jobs?

So, you say, move to where the jobs are. On what money? And where are these jobs?

We are moving backward and not forward and it should scare the fuck out of anyone who truly cares about this country.

It's not going to get better and we are not going to move forward again unless 1 of 3 things happen.
- Government starts requiring better pay not just in the US but by all companies doing business in the US,
- or by ownership deciding people come first and raising wages on their own,
- or by a social revolution much like we had when unions started.

I don't see the government doing much because the money controls the politicians and they are bought and paid for by big business and people who have no desire to lose their place or power.

I don't see ownership doing it, there's too much competition to see which CEO can afford the next 10+ million dollar home. To much fear that if they raise wages their competition will just outsource to a cheaper labor market and undercut them.

And I don't see a social revolution yet because there are no true crusaders out there and the ones that are trying are personally attacked and silenced.

So where does that leave us?

As a country we are on a serious decline, if you think your children will have it better than you then you are fooling yourself or you are ultra rich and taking advantage of the market right now buying up as much as possible in Sheriffs auctions and making investments and have the money to do so and not worry.

I can honestly say I don't have it near as good as my parents did, and in retirement they won't have it as easy as their parents did, and my children will not have it as easy as I did. And in the US that is sad because this country was built on bettering the next generation.... and somewhere we lost that vision.

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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"