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Old 08-10-2005, 11:46 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackthorn
I've often wondered about those magentic stick ons that declare your support for our troops and I'd come to the same conclusion as BoR. The proceeds from the sale of those things are going to the opportunists who are lining their pockets with the money spent on them. True enough that some of them may represent noble causes but the cynic in me believes it is more than likely the former rather than the later.

Make no mistake about it: Iraq is a dangerous place to be. Even if you don't follow the mainstream media you cannot help but know that the insurgents are oportunistically attacking with deadly force. Insurgents is a name that makes me nuts. Let's face it they are TERRORISTS and calling them insurgents connotates an air of legitimacy about them and what they are doing. There is nothing legitimate about them or their cause and until there is a more regionally enforced level of support for stopping these TERRORISTS Iraq will continue to be a yellow bug light attracting them to the possiblity of serving Alah by attacking anything that looks like it came from the West......

.....If you allow yourself to be completely influenced by the myopic views of CNN or other outlets for mainstream media you would naturally come to the conclusion that Iraq is a country spiraling into chaos. It must be incapable of enforcing peace and stability and the Iraqis themselves must be living in fear that if they venture out of their homes they will become the next victim. That is simply not the case although this view is easily supported by the daily accounts of violence in Iraq and by the running body count that seems to carry the same significance as a Yankee vs. Red Sox box score. Just this past week it was TERRORISTS: 14 -- US MARINES: 0. They win if you trivialize the individual losses by keeping score and evaluating the war on only those terms. They win if you dishonor the ultimate sacrifice paid by the more than 1800 American military personnel by reducing this war to a game of numbers.

The brutal regime of Saddam Hussein and his well documented Stalinist legacy of oppression, murder, and explotation now thankfully fades to black. Areas outside of the Sunni Triangle (which refers to a roughly triangular area of Iraq to the northwest of Baghdad inhabited mainly by Sunni Muslims of the same ethnicity as your good friend and former Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein and most of his Ba'ath Party) are now starting to experience luxuries previously only afforded those in Hussein's the inner cirlce. Things we take for granted every day like electricity and clean water are now available to more people and the number of those afforded that luxury grow every day. The lights are now staying on longer and in more parts of the country than at any time in the past 25 years. Roads are being rebuilt and other public infrastructure improvements are taking hold. Schools are opening and young girls are returning to the student population. Business and economic activity on a local level is returning with a vigor not seen in 25 years. The free"er" press is starting to publish many more forms of print publication than have existed at any time in the history of Iraq............

........The following article comes from the USMC web site and details a first hand look at the front lines in Iraq. I was fortunate enough to hear several of the interviews conducted during this visit and it was astounding to me how positive each of the stories came through.

Link



If you are still reading this then have a look here: Link

Blackthorn, the links which you posted are, IMO, Bush/Rumsfeld propaganda financed by our tax dollars. They are inappropriate, if your intent is to offer them to strengthen your argument, because they expose the administration for what it is....deceptive, arrogant, controlling, misleading, and obsessed with censorship. A "puff piece", US armed forces news service report, displayed on a USMC website, is not a news report. Your second "link" is to a self promotional, "Bush touted", pentagon created site, with "messages", posted "spontaneaously" by the public, in "support of the troops", that are censored or deleted by government censors......
Quote:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...041100879.html
Is Bush Vulnerable on Iraq?

By Dan Froomkin
Special to washingtonpost.com
Friday, August 5, 2005; 1:15 PM

......Remember how President Bush earlier this summer asked Americans to log on to AmericaSupportsYou.mil , a Department of Defense Web site, and register support for the troops?

At the time , I did some word searches and it didn't look to me like the site was posting many -- if any -- comments that suggested that the soldiers might be victims of bad policy decisions.

There are now more than 60,000 viewable messages -- out of a reported 128,000 received -- on the site.

I encouraged my colleagues at washingtonpost.com to look into this, and yesterday, Robert MacMillan and Mary Specht reported: "The Defense Department has removed messages containing political commentary from a Web site designed for people to show their support for U.S. forces serving in Iraq and Afghanistan. . . .

"Last month the Wall Street Journal reported that two antiwar messages had disappeared from the site, but at the time the site had no posted policy on political statements."

Now the site has taken down some overtly pro-Bush messages as well, and a policy posted on the site last week now warns that political speech will be barred.

Still unclear: What was the nature of the 60,000-plus messages that never made it to the site in the first place?.........
This "disclaimer" was recently added under the posting template at the site, and may explain the unavailability of more than 60,000 of the messages that the site claims were posted to "support the troops". Why are opinions expressed that advocate withdrawal of US troops from Iraq, or that protest the illegality of pre-emptive war of aggression and invasion of a severeign nation, not considered "support" of our troops?
Quote:
NOTE: We are providing this service as an opportunity to send a message of support to servicemembers. This is not a forum for political opinions, and verbal attacks against organizations, groups or individuals will not be posted. Profanity and violations of operational security, privacy, and propriety will not be posted. These messages are viewed individually and edited or deleted based on content.
Your description of
Quote:
The brutal regime of Saddam Hussein and his well documented Stalinist legacy of oppression, murder, and explotation now thankfully fades to black.
does nothing to address the complicity of the Reagan and Bush '41 regimes in the arming of Saddam with chemical and biological weapons stocks, and the provision of technical advice regarding their production and offensive deployment, and the sale by the U.S of crop dusting bell helicopters used by Saddam, to "gas his own people", and the continuation of the presence of US military advisors and full US diplomatic relations with Saddam's Iraq, as well as a policy of continued sales of sensitve military, and "dual purpose" technology to Iraq, for years after Saddam's "crimes" were committed.

We've covered and documented all of the above described "holes" in your argument, at these links, and it is rare for TFP Politics participants to post in in such a one sided and misinformed manner, because it is difficult to come to terms with Reagan/Bush support of Iraq, with the aggravation of Reagan secretly and illegally selling thousands of anit-tank and other weapons to Iran, during the same period of time.
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showpos...2&postcount=39

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showpos...6&postcount=30

There has been no increase of electrical energy production in Iraq, in the past year, if the numbers cited
in this article two weeks ago are compared ot the LA Times report of Sept., 2004. What has all the money spent to increase electrical generation in Iraq, accomplished?
Quote:
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8736966/
By Suleiman al-Khalidi
Updated: 6:31 a.m. ET July 28, 2005

AMMAN - Iraq's electricity supply has risen above pre-war levels to 5,350 megawatts (MW) despite sabotage, boosted by hydroelectric power and more imports from Iran, Syria and Turkey, the minister in charge said on Thursday.

"Now electricity has reached a record after we broke 5,350 megawatts a few days ago for the first time since the war," Electricity Minister Mohsen Shalash told Reuters......
Quote:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/091304K.shtml
Iraq Power Grid Shows U.S. Flaws
By T. Christian Miller
Los Angeles Times

Sunday 12 September 2004

........Even today, the U.S. has not reached the goal set by L. Paul Bremer III, the former head of the U.S.-led occupation authority, to produce 6,000 megawatts of power a day by June 1. By comparison, California has about 50% more people than Iraq but produces up to eight times as much electricity, about 45,000 megawatts at peak summer demand.

Iraq's electrical production tops out at 5,300 megawatts - higher than peak generation in the closing days of Saddam Hussein's regime, but far below the estimated 7,200 megawatts needed to fulfill the rapidly growing demand. .........
Blackthorn, you dismiss the reporting of CNN, where do you receive the information on current and historical politcal events that leads you to the conclusions about Saddam and Iraq, and the Bush administration, that you've posted?
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