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Originally Posted by host
alansmithee, I hope that you, Pan, and roachboy will forgive me for "barging" in on your "back and forth", but I would like to satisfy my curiousity, and maybe reach a greater understanding about my inability to understand how you, and say... Marvelous Mary, gain and hold your convictions.
The following is a post from Marvelous Mary, which is a response to zen_tom:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...t=91489&page=2
(Near bottom of page)
zen_tom makes (IMO, anway) the easily defended statement that ,"Iraq didn't have any weapons of mass destruction and the US waging a war based on that issue", and Marvelous Mary countered with a reference to "UN SCR 687", and an article from a consrvative Harvard student periodical that offers it's own analysis of Charles Duelfer's 10/2004 WMD report, that is intended to persuade that the U.S. was justified in invading Iraq, and that Bush did not mislead, because.....only the U.S. administrations reaction to 9/11 intervened to blunt Saddam's "waiting game", whereby, when the U.N. sanctions ended, he would have put his dormant WMD programs in high gear, and emerged as a
menace to the world.. ... (my comments continue below MM's post....)
Marvelous Mary ended her response to zen_tom with:
alansmithee, as the self appointed, repetitive poster of the overwhelming evidence that Saddam did not possess WMD, and that key members of the Bush administration were either reported, in 2001 and 2002, to either agree
that he had not reconsituted his WMD programs, or are directly quoted as saying that, along with WH press secretary McClellan's Jan. 12, 2005 admission to the press that Bush agreed that no WMD were found, or were likely to be found, based on the Duelfer report, in areas outside of Iraq, such as Syria, and my recently posted quotes from Bush and Rice that:
and that Bush had claimed that:
In late January 2003, in his SOTU address, more than a month after Iraq had presented it's data and inventory of WMD and WMD programs to the U.N.,
Bush claimed that Iraq's WMD inventory, as a justification for war, included:
.....I am confident that it diminishes the credibility of any individual of any ideology to disagree that Bush misled and exaggerated to the point that he either could be called a liar, or incredibly misinformed to the degree that he was incompetent or inept.
Even with this body of formidible evidence, I still find myself having to post it again and again on these threads. The trend is that resistance to the evidence is shrinking.
My question to you is, in the face of this evidence, why do people still defend Bush with such anger, as MM did, and what do you think that it will take, as
far as evidence, if an admission from Bush himself is not sufficient enough for posts such as MM's to cease here? Why is is so difficult to process such straightforward, well documented arguments? |
Now I'm a supporter of the war?????? Because I am speaking out against the fucking partisanship that is destroying us faster than the terrorists could ever dream of?
That's a new one.
I'm very vocal against the war in Iraq. Have been. But I am also a realist and if we are going to be there then let's do what we can to end it as quickly and with as few as possible casualties.
This fucking bickering over who is fucking right and who is fucking wrong has been getting us nowhere and is destroying us from within.
If some of you who choose to continue arguing your side and putting down the other without even so much as a legitimate civilized debate then you are the problem.
I was. I admit it, and there are issues I will still argue, but I have come to the conclusion that where the left and the right extremists see compromise and trying to work with each other as weakness, it's wrong. We share this country and our lives and happinesses are dependant upon this country moving forward. The only way we will ever move forward is to stop this "Fuck you I'm right and you're wrong" attitudes.
It's dividing the nation and right now we are about as divided as we have ever been since the Civil War.
When talking heads of 1 party sit and trash their political rivals on a horrendous day and blame the other side for allowing it to happen while the terrorists laugh at the fact we are feasting on each other and destroying ourselves far worse than they ever could....... something is seriously wrong here.
When days after the attackl people are pointing fingers and grandstanding and turning the horrendous event into a political attack....... something is seriously wrong.
When sides refuse to talk civilly and instead become more polarized..... something is seriously wrong.
Whether we like it or not, whether we deserve it or not, whether we want to believe it or not...... there are fucking people out there that have the sole intention in life to KILL us. And they are eventually going to become more dangerous and threatening unless we do something to stop them.
It's not a question of whether they will ever get "dirty bombs", "suitcase nukes" or viral diseases to spread true anguish and pain.......
It's a question of when.
And if we stay at each other's fucking throats and pay more attention to trying to win political brownie points.....WE WILL FUCKING DIE!!!!!!!
So grow the fuck up, get your shit together and start fucking getting along or we're dead. It is that plain and simple.
Do you think these terrorists give 1 iota who is right over here and who is wrong???????
No, they're laughing their asses off because they know the more we fight within, the more divided our house is..... the less we pay attention to what they are doing and they can plan their attacks and pull them off with little resistance.
I'm not going to sit here and watch fucking partisan assholes destroy my country, destroy what I love because they are too fucking arrogant and ignorant to listen to anyone that doesn't agree with them.
And if you disagree with what I say..... hey great that's what this country is about...... but YOU tell me how divisive partisan politics is helping us to beat the terrorists and not destroy the country.
I appologize for the language and the temper..... but people wake up and see that we are so divided we are truly destroying ourselves.