Quote:
|
Originally Posted by filtherton
My point was that if someone self identifies as christian, than they are, in fact, a christian. Whether that passes muster with you in terms of accurately defining their faith is irrelevant. I can be christian and not read the bible. I can be christian and not go to church. I can have a close personal relationship with jesus christ and still think that most of the people who represent his teachings are self righteous and insecure. I can believe in the existence and teachings of jesus christ and beyond that do no more in the name of christ and still be a christian. Depending on your perspective, having a close personal relationship with jesus christ would automatically exclude you from any kind of faith practiced in a church. Even if someone is a christian only because they self identify as a christian, who do you think they pray to when they're in a jam?
|
If they have a relationship with Jesus Christ, then they think about religion. I would assume them to be Christian. My point is that there are people who self-identify as Christian who don't even do that much. It takes some act outise of saying you are Christian to truly be one, even if that is simply accepting Christ at some point in your life. And honestly I would assume they wouldn't pray, or if they did it would be a generic prayer.
Quote:
|
You mean those who don't practice the same way as you. You do know that you are currently attacking their particular brand of christianity by saying that they aren't really christians.
|
I'm not attacking people who don't practice Christianity like me, I'm talking about people who practice NO form of Christianity.
Quote:
|
Nobody blinks, or nobody feels like it's something they need to get all up in arms about? When someone makes light of something you self-identify with you can choose either to get offended or you can choose to take it in stride, or you can recognize the value in being able to laugh at yourself and chuckle. Choosing not to get offended does not make you a bad christian. It doesn't mean that your faith is under attack. It means you are relatively well adjusted when it comes to ball busting. Maybe the reason nobody raises an eyebrow is that they too, despite being christian, also have certian beefs with christianity as it is practiced by certain people. Certainly you can relate to that. You didn't get offended when i criticized the brand of christianity practiced by pat robertson. You agreed with me. There are valid criticisms of christianity. They aren't always expressed in a very productive form, but they do exist.
|
OK, so next time someone in sports calls someone a fag and GLAAD gets angered, I'll remember it's just because homosexuals aren't well adjusted and that they should just take it in stride because it doesn't mean they're under attack.
Quote:
|
Christians are the majority. If christian ridicule is as widespread as you claim, it could only be so with the blessing of millions of christians. Furthermore, it is quite possible that christianity is being mocked by christians. Kevin Smith is a practicing catholic, despite the fact that "dogma" was a satire of the catholic dogma. I know quite a few christians who feel that mel gibson's brand of christianity is a complete joke. You yourself criticize other christians who you feel aren't pious enough. Does that make you a good christian for looking after your dogma, or does that make you one of the many americans attacking christianity?
|
I'm not simply talking of satire or jokes. I'm talking of the widespread ability for people to whitewash all religious people as ignorant, stupid, illogical, etc. without being challenged. I don't criticize Robertson as a Christian who doesn't think he's pious enough, I criticize him because he's a hypocrite.
Quote:
If we're talking about the entertainment industry, i don't think there are that many forces who discourage homosexuality. In fact, it seems pretty obvious that an attractive female artist(britney spears) wishing for a boost of publicity need only make out with another attractive female artist(madonna). Queer eye is a hit. Gay people are very marketable.
If we're talking about american culture in general, homosexuals are under attack. The forces that "discourage" homosexuality do so with violence, discrimination(more malignant than not being allowed to lead a public prayer or put up christmas decorations in the town square), and attempted constitutional amendments. When was the last time you heard of a christian getting the shit kicked out of him for his faith? When was the last time you heard of someone getting fired from their job just for being a christian? When do you think the antagonists in the christian right's persecution fantasy are finally going to make their move and pass a constitutional amendment outlawing the practice of christianity?
|
Christians face the same, if not more attacks, than homosexuals simply because the attacks on Christians are more accepted. There was in the last year 2 Christian camp councellors who were murdered supposedly because of their beliefs. And in Pennsylvania a year or 2 ago a woman was fired for wearing a cross in class. And those are just off the top of my head. As to when an amendment will be passed outlawing the practice of Christanity, it might not be far off. This topic was started with a post saying essentially that if you are religious, you should not be able to follow your beliefs in public office. And as you even pointed out, prayer is being banned in schools (not school sponsored prayer, but student led prayer) and nativity scenes are being disallowed. Imagine the uproar if gays were told they can be gay, just don't mention it in politics and don't vote on any gay issues. And you also have to not act gay in public. And if you are at school, no mention of being gay at all. There would be an outcry. But these sorts of things happen to Christians all the time. The people who want these things done to Christians are bigots, and nothing but.
Quote:
|
In spite? Where i lived the "passion of the christ" got as much attention as the choosing of the new pope. That shit was every where. All that despite the fact that it was a historically inaccurate unnecessarily gory snuff film based on a version of catholic dogma too conservative for even the catholic church. In jesus walks kanye successfully stuck his foot in his mouth. He wrote a song about how nobody in the music industry respects christianity and it becomes a hit single. "You can rap about anybody, except for jesus" my ass.
|
Yes, in spite of the opposition by many in the entertainment industry. The Passion got attention because people showed up at theaters. Jesus Walks got airplay because people wanted to hear it. They weren't pushed.
Quote:
|
Pop culture exists to make money. Content is secondary to the bottom line. The fact is that pop culture avoids the issue of religion whenever possible, because that is one thing that people are liable to flip the fuck out over.
|
I don't think that's the whole reason, but definately a part of the reason. But again, I don't think it's necessarily good to mix religion with pop culture. I would just like to see less of an anti-Christian tone.