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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
Right. Simply wanting to know why people are certain places is sticking one's nose into someone else's business. I'm not suggesting calling the police when you don't feel safe is wrong, I'm suggesting that this guy's sense of fear is misplaced.
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A stranger in your enclosed neighbourhood is worth iquiring about. This is true of a small town or an apartment building.
In this case, the stranger was hiding in a small dark room with one entrance and exit.
[quote="Master_Shake"]
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Originally Posted by Yakk]es, if someone is tresspassing for extended periods of time, I'd call the police[/quote]
Ok, but what about when someone MAY be tresspassing, when you don't know if the guy's tresspassing. That's what this story was about.[/quote]
You asked a direct question as if it had a point. I answered the question directly. Now you go and claim my answer is irrelivent to the point at hand?
I've explained why it was reasonable to call the police. I've even repeated the justification above my last quote of yours.
[quote="Master_Shake
What argument did I make up? Your argument appears to be that by virtue of being a stranger the man is suspicious and you need to protect yourself. If that's the case, then the only way to protect yourself is to lock yourself in a castle because there are a lot of strangers out there. That's not a straw man.
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You attacked a position I did not hold, and claimed it as a victory. You just did it again, right above me. It's a straw man attack.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
You're right, he said he wouldn't have just said "Ho hum..." For some crazy reason I thought that meant he would therefore get involved in the situation and call the cops, just like he did in this case. I was obviously way out of line.
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If A AND B imply C, where A is "slightest inkling of danger" and C is "call the cops", it does not mean that "slightest inlking of danger" implies "call the cops".
You will note that the first impulse was to go ask the guy what he was up to. Only when convinced (by his girlfriend) that this might not be safe did he call the police.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
Wow, you really don't feel safe do you? I had no idea you lived in an area with such a high crime rate.
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No, I don't live in an area with a high crime rate. Once again, you ignore the massive number of qualifications I put on my statement.
I do feel safe.
I don't feel all that safe if I'm in a dark alley between two houses with nobody nearby to hear me shout, in an area where I know everyone, and a stranger approaches me, while living in an armed society. This would be an example of a case that satisfies the list of qualifications I made on my statement.
When I qualify statements, I do it for a reason, usually. Don't ignore the qualifications please.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
Perhaps I wasn't clear earlier, but it wasn't just his calling the police that I disagreed with, it was his decision to get involved at all (that he chose to do so through the police is his right I suppose). Based on the evidence he described, I do not see how a reasonable person could come to the conclusion that the person was engaged in nefarious activities. But then I see people I don't know all the time, and I don't live in a perfectly controlled, temperature-regulated, gated community of white folks.
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He was right -- the person was up to mildly nefarious activities (tresspassing).
At the very least, people who spend large amounts of time near your home and family should be interacted with.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
As do I, but saying: "You may not have a right to spend time in another person's property, but I don't know so I'm going to call the police," I don't support.
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He was staying on someone else's property (the storage room) without permission. When does it move from 'spend time' to 'live'?
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
I don't think it's overly broad to say that the purpose is punishment. Sure, there may be a few elements of rehabilitation, but the purpose (again, from my experience and the experiences I see) is punishment.
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Then you should study up on regimes that have their justice truely based on punishment.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
Where do you live that the criminal justice system works so well?
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My location is visible on the left. This would also be true in the U.K., as an aside -- I was under the impression that the police there have stopped bothering to prosecute possession of small amounts of MJ.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
I think you should adhere to the same standards the cops are supposed to, reasonable suspicion or probable cause.
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I disagree. The government has special rights and obligations and restrictions. We lack those powers and rights. We also lack some of it's obligations and restrictions.
Individuals are, should and will be more free that governments in many situations.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
Sure, bring out the old children have to be protected argument. Children should not dictate the limits of adult activity. You want to protect them then keep them indoors. People having sex, what a terrible thing to see.
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Parents want to protect children. If parents can arrange for communities where their children are adequitly protected, that is ok with me.
You like living near prostitutes. More power to you, live in an area that welcomes prostitutes.
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Originally Posted by Master_Shake
If the dog shits on my neighbor's yard, and I don't know if the dog is his or not or if the dog has permission to shit there, THEN it's none of my business.
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All it takes for shit to accumulate is for neighbours to do nothing. ;-)