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Rekna · 02-13-2005, 08:04 AM

The holier than thou additude is definatly not christian. Christians are to be humble in all aspects of their life. Humbly love your wives, humbly love your neighbors, humbly love your enemies. Just be humble.

Now to further explain my position.

Salvation is a gift, and nothing short of a gift. There is no legalism to get into heaven, we just need to accept Gods love. See Galations for talk on legalism of the church.

Works are not what is required to get into heaven, but God does want us to do good works, it pleases him. God's love is unconditional ours is not. God chooses to love us even when we don't love him. But when we truely love God we will do good works because who doesn't want to please those they love? Strong faith will produce good works but in no way is it required. If works are still required did Jesus die for nothing? He died so we could be forgiven, he died so we could be saved. In his death he saved every one who believes in him.

Now to the verse mentioned earlier James 2:14-16 What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action is dead.

What was James saying here? Was he saying we need faith and works? If it does say that doesn't this directly contradict what Paul taught? Before I answer that lets look a little bit at the history of the bible. When Martian Luther split from the church creating the beginning of protestant churches he recompiled the bible (notice the catholic bible is different than the one everyone else uses). James was almost cut from the bible because it seemed to be a direct contradiction to what Paul taught. But through studying it closer they decided it wasn't a contradiction and kept it. So what is James saying here.

Here is what my study bible says (NIV zondervan version) "faith" is not used in the sense of genuine, saving faith. Rather, it is demonic, useless, and dead. It is a mere intellectual acceptance of certian truths without trust in Christ as Savior. James is also not saying that a person is saved by works and not by genuine faith. Rather, he is saying, to use Martin Luther's words, that people are justified (declared righteous before God) by faith alone, but not by a faith that is alone. Genuine faith will produce good deeds, but only faith in Christ saves.

This is very simalar to what I am saying. We are saved by grace and grace alone. But those who have the strongest faiths will desire in their heart to do good works and will do them. But in the end it is not the works that are required, only the faith in God. So do good works because God desires it and so do our hearts. Live your life as a pillar so that you are salty and you make those around you thirsty. But never forget it is not you who gets you into heaven but only God. God is the only way to heaven we do not earn our way and cannot earn our way. None of us deserve heaven it is given to us freely. The second we start believing in ourselfs instead of God we have stopped being humble. And when we aren't humble God will make us humble.

02-13-2005, 08:04 AM	#108 (permalink)
Rekna Junkie	The holier than thou additude is definatly not christian. Christians are to be humble in all aspects of their life. Humbly love your wives, humbly love your neighbors, humbly love your enemies. Just be humble. Now to further explain my position. Salvation is a gift, and nothing short of a gift. There is no legalism to get into heaven, we just need to accept Gods love. See Galations for talk on legalism of the church. Works are not what is required to get into heaven, but God does want us to do good works, it pleases him. God's love is unconditional ours is not. God chooses to love us even when we don't love him. But when we truely love God we will do good works because who doesn't want to please those they love? Strong faith will produce good works but in no way is it required. If works are still required did Jesus die for nothing? He died so we could be forgiven, he died so we could be saved. In his death he saved every one who believes in him. Now to the verse mentioned earlier James 2:14-16 What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action is dead. What was James saying here? Was he saying we need faith and works? If it does say that doesn't this directly contradict what Paul taught? Before I answer that lets look a little bit at the history of the bible. When Martian Luther split from the church creating the beginning of protestant churches he recompiled the bible (notice the catholic bible is different than the one everyone else uses). James was almost cut from the bible because it seemed to be a direct contradiction to what Paul taught. But through studying it closer they decided it wasn't a contradiction and kept it. So what is James saying here. Here is what my study bible says (NIV zondervan version) "faith" is not used in the sense of genuine, saving faith. Rather, it is demonic, useless, and dead. It is a mere intellectual acceptance of certian truths without trust in Christ as Savior. James is also not saying that a person is saved by works and not by genuine faith. Rather, he is saying, to use Martin Luther's words, that people are justified (declared righteous before God) by faith alone, but not by a faith that is alone. Genuine faith will produce good deeds, but only faith in Christ saves. This is very simalar to what I am saying. We are saved by grace and grace alone. But those who have the strongest faiths will desire in their heart to do good works and will do them. But in the end it is not the works that are required, only the faith in God. So do good works because God desires it and so do our hearts. Live your life as a pillar so that you are salty and you make those around you thirsty. But never forget it is not you who gets you into heaven but only God. God is the only way to heaven we do not earn our way and cannot earn our way. None of us deserve heaven it is given to us freely. The second we start believing in ourselfs instead of God we have stopped being humble. And when we aren't humble God will make us humble.