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Old 12-25-2004, 12:03 PM   #39 (permalink)
Yakk
Wehret Den Anfängen!
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
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How is demanding that corporations that get tax abatements (for the sole purpose I described above) and or tax breaks to create jobs social welfare????? It's called bettering the area's economy. It was the GOP's grand idea of the 80's. It was the original conservative movement's idea. Now, those aren't good enough for you? You want more? Even if we can't afford more?
Corperate welfare is welfare, except it usually gets skimmed off the top by the rich. It is a great way to get corperations to bribe, I mean donate huge amounts of money 'question free' to politicians, in order to maintain the government handouts.

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What I propose is government influencing the economy??? Yeah, the government must influence the economy and HAS since the early 1900's when fair labor laws, 40 hour work weeks, overtime, monopoly laws and many child labor laws were introduced. In doing so the economy grew, industry grew and a middle class became prominent.
I don't have a problem with the government influencing the economy as a general rule. Notice alot of the above are laws that cut accross industries, designed to be social welfare laws. What you are describing is large covert money transfers from the general economy into one particular industry or set of industries, because those industries make you feel warm and fuzzy.

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You may not buy into the rich are taxed too much but read other's posts, dealing with taxes. Most of them complain how the rich are taxed too high.
The people in the USA with the highest marginal tax rate are the poor. In some cases, their effective marginal tax rate breaks 100%. If you believe that high marginal tax rates cause a disincentive to work and destroy the economy, fix that first.

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DO YOU HAVE A BETTER SOLUTION TO REDUCE TAX BURDEN WHILE INCREASING TAX BASE IN THE US?????
I didn't claim it was a simple solveable problem. That's your claim, not mine. Just because you want to solve it with a simple solution, doesn't mean it can be solved.

Just because you want to do something, doesn't mean you can. There isn't any such thing as a free lunch.

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When and where are the trade deficts going to end if we continue to buy foreign made goods? If this trade deficit is so unconcerning then why is China one of the biggest buyers of our debt?
The US dollar is going to collapse. The standard of living in the USA is going to go down, the US dollar won't be used as an international currency nearly as much, and with cheaper US labour and more expensive imports, the American trade balance will fix itself.

Right now, American standards of living are being supported by the lack of other places to invest 'safely', the use of American currency as a world currency, and massive borrowing by American people and the American government.

Stop borrowing. Start saving. Increase trade. Live with less. Educate your people, don't rely on immigration to provide America with competent people. Destroy inefficient industries and remove subsidies as a rule. Stop wasting money on ego ventures. Fix your finantial markets, make them trustworthy again.

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This is an economical warfare and China is winning.

Manufacturing is desperately needed by any country. If you do not produce your own goods eventually you will die economically. Because of trade deficits.
Have you looked at China, the air, the water, the standard of living? Compare it to the USA? If that's winning and the USA is losing, then I want to be losing economic wars.

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You tell me what is middle ground that produces decent waged and benefitted jobs.
Educate your populance. Make them smarter and better than other nations. Out compete other nations.

If you close the USA off, the world will close themselves off to the USA. And the world will out compete you until you collapse like the USSR did.

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What you propose is that government has no right to interfere with business, yet, government should give out corporate welfare.
I didn't propose corperate welfare. Are you even reading what I'm writing, or just making this up?

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I'm sorry if I'm in a war I want to know that the ships, guns, missiles, technology, and so on are made by my home country and not a country that makes weapons for the highest bidder.

I'm sure in WW2 we didn't go to Japan or Germany and beg them for weapons so that we could fight them. Yet, if we allow China to destroy our steel industry and we keep shipping jobs overseas that will happen.
If you think the size of your battleships will matter in WW3, you are delusional.

I don't know with what weapons WW3 will be fought, but WW4 will be fought with sticks and stones.

If the justification for your arguements is 'we have to win WW3', you are playing the wrong game. The only way to win WW3 is to prevent it. That is why, after WW2, they build a world economy that tied everyone tightly together and made sure that everyone benefited from the world economy -- make it not worth it to go to war, and people don't go to war nearly as often.

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War is always inevitable. It has always been, People of different regions shall always argue it is in man's nature. And war isn't always bad, it has in the past always eliminated weaker societies and improved the world as a whole. It also develops more technology.
NUCLEAR WEAPONS WILL KILL EVERY PERSON ON EARTH IF THEY ARE USED ON A LARGE SCALE. EVERY POWERFUL NATION ON EARTH CAN BUILD ENOUGH NUCLEAR WEAPONS TO USE THEM ON A LARGE SCALE. Fuck, even Canada, a pint-sized nation with a military smaller than some US state guards, could build enough nuclear weapons to destroy human life on earth, given a few years. And you want to continue playing great power games? Do you have any clue what a fucking stupid idea that is?

And you wonder why polls in the UK believe the USA is the most dangerous nation on Earth. R.R. nuclear bluff in the 80s wasn't what won the economic war with the USSR, the USSR destroyed itself with economic suicide.

USA beat the USSR by unleasing the power of the market, and managing economic growth and expansion that you couldn't sustain in a heavily micro-managed economy. You don't win economic wars by playing at random government micro-management -- that is how you lose the wars.

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Right now we are in an economic war, and we are losing badly. Much like the USSR did. And until we realize that we must take care of our own country and THEN help the rest of the world, we will lose.
Why did the USSR lose the economic war? Because their economy was horribly inefficient and wasteful, it protected inefficient industries, had broken price systems, and in general was a pile of turds. What you are describing is adding waste and inefficincies to the US economy. Waste is an evil. It's a real evil.

Bush's steel tarriffs where just a blatant bribe -- ethically equivilent to saying 'I am going to give everyone in swing state X 1000$ cash if I get elected -- and tax everyone else 100$ to pay for it', but wrapped in the usual Bush-administration patriot-talk propoganda.
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Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.
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