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rog1039 · 12-15-2004, 05:03 AM

One thing that I'm suprised some people argue against is this: Some discipline methods work on some kids and don't work on others. Time outs work on some and don't work on others. Spanking is the same way. It's almost not even worth discussing. Some people think its abuse, others are glad they were spanked. I find it a topic that is not suited for general discussion because it should be considered on an case by case basis.

Secondly, people who view spanking as abuse: I was spanked a few times as a child and I certainly don't believe it is was anywhere near abuse. I definitely cried after a few of them. Big deal. I don't harbor any ill feelings towards my parents. I simply viewed spanking as something I didn't like, and it was something that happened when I made serious errors in judgement. When I look back, spanking never even enters my mind, it is so inconsequential to me. But it did stop me from doing things I should not be doing. Also, for reference, I don't think i was spanked after 6. But, some people were spanked quite roughly and they were abused, or they are people who have a complete aversion to any sort of physical punishment and consider the spanking they recieved abuse, even when others who were spanked would not consider it to be close to abuse. However, other punishments can have a detrimental effect on the child as well. If you scream and yell like a crazed lunatic at your child when they do bad things then they sure as hell aren't going to like you, they will try to not get caught, and they will most likely fear you. It's the same thing that will happen to a kid if you spank too harshly, or even if you spank a kid who will not be receptive to it. Some kids will take a spanking differently then others. Just a simple spanking may be enough to change the view that a child has of his parents. He may fear them because of it. If that might be the case with one of your kids, then don't spank them. But for others, it can be very effective and not detrimental towards the kids at all. It's the same with any punishment; the child must be looked at. What would work best for this child? Spanking, time out, a stern no, whatever it is, just do what is effective and what you believe will have the least negative effect, if any, on the child, while, at the same time, will get the message across that they should not do that again. An overall idea such as, spanking is horrible never do it, or spanking is great I'm going to spank all my kids is not the way to approach this problem.

Also, about the quote about 100% of people in prison have been spanked. Even with the source to that study, I still don't think I will believe it. Even if that were true, I'm quite sure they are leaving out a whole lot of important information that would help you draw a useful conclusion from that study. Assuming that most people in prison did not have a good childhood its safe to assume that that person was not only spanked, but had to deal with other problems as well. They were probably yelled at excessively, possibly ignored, etc. There are a whole lot of things that also happened to them. To say that your child has a higher chance of going to prison just because they were spanked, I think, is highly misleading. Done in the proper way, I don't believe spanking has any causal relationship with growing up to being a bad person.

I'm not a parent myself, so I suppose its possible I am overlooking the biggest assumption I make during my argument: when I talk about doing what is best for the child involved and I assume that a parent can determine that. However, I realize that is not always the case. It may not be easy to figure out what will be the most effective and least harmful punishment for each child. But I think that is up for the parents of that child to determine. I don't think its up for the government to decide. Sure, there is the possibility the parents will make the wrong decision and spank a child who will not be receptive to it. But that happens in any area regarding discipline, or even the raising, of a child. It's the parent's child, not the governments, so let the parents decide how to do it. I'm not saying the government shouldn't step in when the parents go overboard (read: abuse), but to implement a law that tells parents how to deal with their kids is not only arrogant, but I think a very serious breach in personal freedom.

And finally, I have to reiterate what the other people above me have said. Spanking, when used effectively, is not the only method of discipline. It is used in combination with other methods.

p.s. To those who believe any form of spanking is abuse, you are the the child I am talking about above. You are the type who would not be receptive to spanking. So other methods of discipline should be used with you. However, you should not push your views on others and say plainly "spanking is abuse". I certainly don't agree with you and others who support spanking in the conditions that will cause it to be effective and will not negatively effect the child, won't agree with you either. But I do recognize that spanking isn't for all children, hence my incredibly long-winded post above.

12-15-2004, 05:03 AM	#108 (permalink)
rog1039 Upright	One thing that I'm suprised some people argue against is this: Some discipline methods work on some kids and don't work on others. Time outs work on some and don't work on others. Spanking is the same way. It's almost not even worth discussing. Some people think its abuse, others are glad they were spanked. I find it a topic that is not suited for general discussion because it should be considered on an case by case basis. Secondly, people who view spanking as abuse: I was spanked a few times as a child and I certainly don't believe it is was anywhere near abuse. I definitely cried after a few of them. Big deal. I don't harbor any ill feelings towards my parents. I simply viewed spanking as something I didn't like, and it was something that happened when I made serious errors in judgement. When I look back, spanking never even enters my mind, it is so inconsequential to me. But it did stop me from doing things I should not be doing. Also, for reference, I don't think i was spanked after 6. But, some people were spanked quite roughly and they were abused, or they are people who have a complete aversion to any sort of physical punishment and consider the spanking they recieved abuse, even when others who were spanked would not consider it to be close to abuse. However, other punishments can have a detrimental effect on the child as well. If you scream and yell like a crazed lunatic at your child when they do bad things then they sure as hell aren't going to like you, they will try to not get caught, and they will most likely fear you. It's the same thing that will happen to a kid if you spank too harshly, or even if you spank a kid who will not be receptive to it. Some kids will take a spanking differently then others. Just a simple spanking may be enough to change the view that a child has of his parents. He may fear them because of it. If that might be the case with one of your kids, then don't spank them. But for others, it can be very effective and not detrimental towards the kids at all. It's the same with any punishment; the child must be looked at. What would work best for this child? Spanking, time out, a stern no, whatever it is, just do what is effective and what you believe will have the least negative effect, if any, on the child, while, at the same time, will get the message across that they should not do that again. An overall idea such as, spanking is horrible never do it, or spanking is great I'm going to spank all my kids is not the way to approach this problem. Also, about the quote about 100% of people in prison have been spanked. Even with the source to that study, I still don't think I will believe it. Even if that were true, I'm quite sure they are leaving out a whole lot of important information that would help you draw a useful conclusion from that study. Assuming that most people in prison did not have a good childhood its safe to assume that that person was not only spanked, but had to deal with other problems as well. They were probably yelled at excessively, possibly ignored, etc. There are a whole lot of things that also happened to them. To say that your child has a higher chance of going to prison just because they were spanked, I think, is highly misleading. Done in the proper way, I don't believe spanking has any causal relationship with growing up to being a bad person. I'm not a parent myself, so I suppose its possible I am overlooking the biggest assumption I make during my argument: when I talk about doing what is best for the child involved and I assume that a parent can determine that. However, I realize that is not always the case. It may not be easy to figure out what will be the most effective and least harmful punishment for each child. But I think that is up for the parents of that child to determine. I don't think its up for the government to decide. Sure, there is the possibility the parents will make the wrong decision and spank a child who will not be receptive to it. But that happens in any area regarding discipline, or even the raising, of a child. It's the parent's child, not the governments, so let the parents decide how to do it. I'm not saying the government shouldn't step in when the parents go overboard (read: abuse), but to implement a law that tells parents how to deal with their kids is not only arrogant, but I think a very serious breach in personal freedom. And finally, I have to reiterate what the other people above me have said. Spanking, when used effectively, is not the only method of discipline. It is used in combination with other methods. p.s. To those who believe any form of spanking is abuse, you are the the child I am talking about above. You are the type who would not be receptive to spanking. So other methods of discipline should be used with you. However, you should not push your views on others and say plainly "spanking is abuse". I certainly don't agree with you and others who support spanking in the conditions that will cause it to be effective and will not negatively effect the child, won't agree with you either. But I do recognize that spanking isn't for all children, hence my incredibly long-winded post above.