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Originally Posted by Manx
It is not exactly a refutation of irate's statement, as his statement does not claim that all non-biblical cultures define marriage as between a man and a woman. But it does point out that although there may be other cultures that have that definition of marriage, there are also apparently cultures that include same sex couples in the definition. Which is interesting all by itself.
But all of that is beside the point of this discussion, as far as I can tell. Irate seemed to be making a point about Bush's desire to define marriage as heterosexual. I would like to know why Irate feels that other cultures, with restrictive definitions of marriage, have much if anything to do with the culture from which Bush derives his moral evaluations. Is it to claim that Bush is basing his belief system on some other culture than the one that is based on the Bible?
That would seem to be the purpose of Irate's statement. But I find it to be an odd opinion, the man is after all a Born Again Christian.
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What he seems to be doing is basing his definition (or Bush's) on an idea that there is a natural order.
That the bible reflects the natural order, because it is truth about the natural order of the universal laws of humanity.
yet, in order to substaniate that, one would need to find evidence of it outside the bible, presumably. so one would logically claim that such a definition existed outside the christian paradigm in order to make the claim that such a definition is a natural one, not socially (or religiously) constructed. Unfortunately, stretching back thousands of years, at least according to this and some other googling, it appears that there is no such thing as a "traditional" form of marriage--at least not one outside the judeo-christianity paradigm.
there certainly is a tradtional one within christianity. But I think irate was trying to make a claim on the natural order of human relations. it seems similar to the claim that homosexuality doesn't occur in the wild--an equally specious claim.
there is no natural barrier to homosexuality, evidently. not in humanity and not in wild animals.