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Originally Posted by scout
Troll baiting are we? Success is purely in perspective. You could argue all night and I doubt it would change anyone's mind as to whether we have been successful or not. Overall, while we haven't been as successful as I feel we should have been, things aren't going as bad as they could be. Therefore we have had some measure of success. On Oct 9th the Afghans will hold an election. Next year the Iraqi's will also hold an election. In some respects, our military is better suited to keep the insurgents busy over there versus civilians here in our streets, it appears the combatants are more evenly matched this way. As ustwo stated, there hasn't been an attack here since 9/11, so that has to be counted as some sort of success. So yes we have had setbacks, but there has been a few things to cheer about. From your perspective you may not feel there has been any success, but from my view we have been at least 75% successful. As I stated above, success is merely a perspective or opinion. Opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.
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We have had zero success in the stated expectations. It might be a "success" in your mind that Iraq will hold elections almost 2 years after we invaded - but that is not where the bar for success was placed before the invasion. If elections were not able to held in Iraq for 10 years, you could still call that a "success" if you wanted to. And that
assumes an election in a predominant Shite country will result in a secular democracy. Maybe we're successful because Al Qaeda has not destroyed America? Maybe we're successful because Bin Laden didn't start a nuclear holocaust?
This administration has promised things which any sane person knew were impossible. Even now, the neo-cons are trying to make us forget that they even said it would be easy. They based their plan of action on those promises - and therefore they failed. Or, they knew all along that their promises were impossible but intentionally deceived the populace. Either way I'm looking for one reason that we should continue to allow proven dreamers or liars to manage the country.
It's all nice and wonderful to hold the opinion that things have been successful - but considering the measurement for success has been constantly lowered, you can't expect your opinion of success to carry much weight.