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Originally Posted by Mr Mephisto
I'm talking about the Irish War for Independence, and you seem to be missing my point. It is possible to fight a war without degenerating into terrorism. It's not that difficult a concept.
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I'm trying to find the method the Chechens could use to fight this war which would not result in their total destruction within days or their total subjugation of living in a Stalinist dictatorship.
They are vastly outnumbered. Vastly outgunned, technologically. And have basically zero international support.
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I'm not really sure I understand what you're saying here. Are you saying that all/any Chechens would "probably" be killed by the Russian military? Or just these terrorists? It's not clear what you're saying.
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Chechens have three options:
1- Give up and let Moscow tell them how to live (i.e. stop trying to be free).
2- Let Moscow kidnap/torture/murder them
3- Fight to the death ... which would be quick and complete
I would choose option 3. But if all Chechens choose option 3, all Chechens would be killed - this is genocide commited by the Russians.
Should I, as an American, just wait until that comes to pass and then denounce the Russians as evil, or should I look at the entire situation (not just the most recent act of either side) and point out that there is no Good side and there is no Evil side in this war? Both sides are acting equally incorrect and need to stop.
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Exactly what I said. Political means. Work within the system. Vote in a regime that will slowly, peacefully move away from Moscow.
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This is what they did. They tried to peacefully move away from Moscow. Moscow responded by attacking them.
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You asked what other options there were. I didn't realise you meant "What other, quick and dirty, no holds barred, anything goes options are there?"
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That's not what I meant. I mean what else do you think could possibly happen? Everything you have suggested does not apply.
[quote]And for the record, the EU has
repeatedly criticised the RF for its actions in Chechnya. Without actually going to war with the Russia there's not much else that can be done.[/quote[
That's exactly my point.
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So it hasn't worked in the past 10 years. Therefore you justify the murder of innocent civilians and children and the sick?
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I'm not justifying anything. I'm asking what you (or an American) would do? So far, the suggestions you offered would clearly be 100% ineffectual.
No. It is quite clearly not simple.
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I have a good understanding of both sides of any conflict. I can understand everyone's point of view, even Al Queda and Hezbollah and other terrorist/freedom fighting groups around the world.
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You speak those words, but I don't see that as being true. You have offered up no logical recourse which would not result in either their continued suffering or their death.
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Finally, just one observation. There is an underlying implication in your entire argument that the Chechen seperatists are "rightgeous" in their actions. You should know that the majority of Chechen's do NOT support this kind of act. And your use of terms like "Stalinist" (when it is clearly not appropriate) also devalue your argument.
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I disagree with this completely.
I have already stated what I would do if I were in their position. And my actions would be a tacit agreement that life is hopeless. I would not threaten children - but the result would be the destruction of my people.
Is that righteous?