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Old 05-19-2004, 04:07 PM   #13 (permalink)
Sun Tzu
Conspiracy Realist
 
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Location: The Event Horizon
(* I make every attempt to find sources that are unbiased as possible (which can be hard to do) and generally and hopefully seen as neutral as possible) If your research into them proves otherwise, please let me know so I can hopefully find one with the same data and seen as acceptable. I want to comment that I do with every source someone provides. I check out the site creators, investigate what information on their background is available; and checking their sources as far as the line has record of. If there are any grammatical or spelling errors please excuse- these long post take up time and while I know mistakes can distract the point- its the substance and the questions I pose that hold the most weight to me- Thanks)

I’ll just continue to intersect every time one of these threads pops up with the same info I always post yet seems to go unanswered. There are two elements I find frustrating about this: subject 1) Anytime I hear George W talk about it in any shape or form (for reasons I’ll go into if needed) 2) Obviously politically seasoned people who appear to approach issues with a researched analytical view of critical thinking taking the stands they do. From anyone that’s read my threads I’m totally against what Israel is doing. (Let me rephrase that----it’s not Israel; there are a growing number of Israelis that are also against what’s happening. It’s the Likud Party and primarily Zionism that have major issue with. This subject is on the verge of costing me a few friendships; which sucks. Here’s my problem: I know that if I were to walk into a Palestinian neighborhood (which years ago I did without issues-but times have changed) there’s no doubt in my mind they’d be out to kill me. I also know if the Israeli soldiers knew I was an American and thought I was a supporter of Israel they would act as an ally. That doesn’t make it right. Perhaps I attribute it to traveling there so many times that this is more personal to me than other troubled areas.

With absolutely ZERO sarcasm from my perspective; Instead of just posting the info to try and prove something, I’m posting it and asking for someone to explain a perspective that I seem totally oblivious to. These forms of media are a small amount of data I have used to arrive at where I’m at.

1) Pushing the most honest element of righteousness aside; Conquest, the foundation of the Zionist philosophy rests in previous ancient residence as set forth by their divine right. Well then technically they should move aside for any descendent of the Canaanites. Divine right? That’s too much for me to go into. One of the better sources I found for bibliogical history

http://www.earth-history.com/Earth-01.htm

http://domino.un.org/unispal.nsf/cf0...2561150071fdb0!OpenDocument

http://domino.un.org/unispal.nsf/cf0...256ddb007bb36f!OpenDocument

2) From the historical research I’ve come to accept the Arab aggression didn’t occur until immigration caps were initially being intermittently exceeded progressing to straightly being ignored as the Holocaust progressed; influencing Britain to cease in its regulation efforts. Let’s look at what scenario the immigrants were coming into. 1922 census was taken in the month of October. It showed a total population of 757,182, of whom 78% were Moslems, 11% were Jews and 9•6% Christians (of which contain some Arab)





http://domino.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/a...c?OpenDocument

My interpretation is the partition far exceeded the land legally bought by the new residents; angering the Arabs. The partition right or wrong is what multiple members voted on so that’s the way things go. Manifest Destiny happened as it did because that’s the way things go. One would think as a world perhaps there has been a progression in social evolution since such times; yeah. By the recognition by a majority of EARTH; Israel is a state that has the right to exist and live in peace. The problem is: dealing with the SIGNIFCANT loss of territory; and abridged territorial coherency the Arabs sustained in their side of the deal; they had to start dealing with the same shit they’re dealing with today. And that is Israeli leaders and Zionists (I’m careful to realize that it’s not correct or fair to just say Israel or Israelis) were going to settle for what they had; what they given (as immigrants) they wanted it all. (WB and GS) Settlers did then; prior to the war; as they continue to do now- illegally assume land that is internationally recognized as belonging to the INDIGENOUS population.

My interpretation of that war; Israel did a very successful war campaign. I don’t think anyone can deny that or should. Why was the war started? Arab aggression. Why were the Arabs aggressing? The partition that happened years prior? They “Wanted to throw them into the ocean”? Aside from an immigration agreement that was violated because of spiritual beliefs- (that may carry questionable points of validity in and of themselves) I truly don’t understand how a person can research the progression: starting with UN addresses made by the Founding Zionist leaders to Oslo and not see what the “Grand Plan” is.

http://www.doublestandards.org/shockwave/barak_eng.swf



Prior to the second uprising; prior to the suicide bombings I wonder if people truly understand what was happening in the OT.

That was yesterday; let’s talk about today. It appears to me that anyone that fully supports Israel; sees it being acceptable for illegal settlements to exist. Put daily harassment, unwarranted incarceration, agriculture razing, closing educational institutions, and similar actions aside. Because while it seems to now be effective to label them countermeasures to terrorism; the truth these actions were occurring long before the bombings began. If a small amount of looking over current maps an equation that seems so obvious to me appears to be nonexistent to others. Even more so with Bush now basically saying that the settlements are OK. (not that an assumed US veto will occur with any resolution drawn on Israel- even basic human rights) So here is where I would SINCERELY welcome feedback or some information that I must be missing.

The bottom line to me is this: everyday those settlers continue to annex land in territory they shouldn’t even be in. They do this with simple fencing. In other words they are just taking the land bit by bit. If a farmer or landowner resists this appropriation they are a TERRORIST. So as population increases within both cultures with these territories; the degree of point blank approaches at an accelerated rate. The Wall is going to push it even faster. Point blank being the situation with there is zero buffer area between the settlers and Palestinians. I see the land that can still call somewhat they’re own shrinking and becoming encircled by Israeli control. One might not even call it occupation thanks to George W. They are there to stay. Does anyone truly believe they are going to stop? Can someone explain how this doesn’t resemble cultural genocide? I’m confident that the IDF would allow Palestinian residents to peacefully exit the West Bank and go stack on top of their fellow refugees in Jordan. But events and action seem to define there are going to be no other options available. Lastly the part that puzzles me the absolute most is the impression I interpret from people that the Palestinians should take this situation with a smile on their face. I’m trying to truly comprehend on how people are seeing differently on this. With the evitable collision of cultures approaching: I’m curious to those that agree with Israel’s actions; what they feel the Palestinians should do. Te me this particular campaign of genocide isn’t like what the Jews themselves experienced or even what we’ve seen in other parts of the world. This trend is slow, very deliberate, very calculated, and closing in with each day. So we all agree that suicide bombing is a bad thing. Attacking settlers that continue to multiply and expand on Palestinian land is a bad thing, hijacking is a bad thing, and lastly obviously attacking tanks with rocks is a bad thing; so with the wall being built, the settlers getting more support than even now what should the remaining Palestinians in Israel do? What steps does the younger generation need to take for the scenario their future holds?

Israel says it was an accident-- ofcourse thats a paraphrase and I really dont know if MSNBC is biased as I have seen reports that seem to favor each at different times.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5004007/
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Last edited by Sun Tzu; 05-19-2004 at 04:16 PM..
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