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Zeld2.0 · 05-16-2004, 10:06 PM

Shades I can certainly echo your comment on colleges and minorities - it does still irk me that they allow for 'points' or whatever system to a minority based on race. I've voted heavily against that treatment in CA and a lot of times, even many other minorities have agreed to shoot it down. Now I went to a prestigious school in the end anways and did fine and all but here goes..

I thinkwe just have to be careful on what line we draw it. On the one hand, there are many people in minorities who really are brilliant and excellent students. What might shock many people outside of California though is no surprise to many living in CA itself is the fact that in the UC (University of California) system, a very large % of the schools are Asian a very small % in the country (4% last i checked).

I don't remember the exact numbers but it something like this: At University of California Irvine, the number of Asians is closer to 50% than 30%. At Berkeley, the conservative estimate is 30%.

That's a lot of students and considering each school has an average of something like 20,000 students - it leads to two conclusions/ideas:

1 - Minorities can succeed. This is true and applies to everyone. Now on the one hand its because many Asians are either first or second generation immigrants here and often there is a lot of pressure to succeed from their parents or themselves. I will say, though, that most of these people are fairly well off in society or are around the average but certainly few are in the poverty range.

2 - Minorities are taking up spaces (the other conclusion). That is what one might say - but I think that large # of people that is disproportionately Asian is hard to say. The UCs don't give points or anything to Asians and indeed most Asians feel they are cheated out by other races now since they have such a large percentage.

From my own experiences with the system, from friends, and from thoughts I can echo your sentiment that race is often times a factor.

But I don't think its worth blaming things over racial treatment as certainly there are a ton of people capable in college, jobs, wherever without a need for preferential treatment.

That being said, however, I will still say that economic factors are most likely to dictate a person's performance and not race and it should be financial and economic considerations, not race.

05-16-2004, 10:06 PM	#80 (permalink)
Zeld2.0 Cherry-pickin' devil's advocate Location: Los Angeles	Shades I can certainly echo your comment on colleges and minorities - it does still irk me that they allow for 'points' or whatever system to a minority based on race. I've voted heavily against that treatment in CA and a lot of times, even many other minorities have agreed to shoot it down. Now I went to a prestigious school in the end anways and did fine and all but here goes.. I thinkwe just have to be careful on what line we draw it. On the one hand, there are many people in minorities who really are brilliant and excellent students. What might shock many people outside of California though is no surprise to many living in CA itself is the fact that in the UC (University of California) system, a very large % of the schools are Asian a very small % in the country (4% last i checked). I don't remember the exact numbers but it something like this: At University of California Irvine, the number of Asians is closer to 50% than 30%. At Berkeley, the conservative estimate is 30%. That's a lot of students and considering each school has an average of something like 20,000 students - it leads to two conclusions/ideas: 1 - Minorities can succeed. This is true and applies to everyone. Now on the one hand its because many Asians are either first or second generation immigrants here and often there is a lot of pressure to succeed from their parents or themselves. I will say, though, that most of these people are fairly well off in society or are around the average but certainly few are in the poverty range. 2 - Minorities are taking up spaces (the other conclusion). That is what one might say - but I think that large # of people that is disproportionately Asian is hard to say. The UCs don't give points or anything to Asians and indeed most Asians feel they are cheated out by other races now since they have such a large percentage. From my own experiences with the system, from friends, and from thoughts I can echo your sentiment that race is often times a factor. But I don't think its worth blaming things over racial treatment as certainly there are a ton of people capable in college, jobs, wherever without a need for preferential treatment. That being said, however, I will still say that economic factors are most likely to dictate a person's performance and not race and it should be financial and economic considerations, not race.