Quote:
Originally posted by smooth
Liberals aren't trying to do that--we are trying to change the actions of our government and sometimes the beliefs of other citizens around us. But we still want it to be the United States of America, with a government that embodies the beliefs of its citizentry.
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see, this is where we part ways. conservatives often believe that changing the beliefs of the citizens is un-american in and of itself because they define what it is to be an american by those beliefs. it seems that liberals (i'm not assuming this about you smooth, although it may be so) define the american belief system by the current environment while conservatives define it as something less subject to change.
if you define the United States of America with a belief system that has constants... then any attempt to change those constants fundamentally changes what it is you're believing in. if conservatives feel a liberal is attempting to change the foundation of what they define as the United States of America (and it is agreed between us that liberals advocate the change of beliefs in some cases) then it logically follows from those premises that those actions are un-american as defined by the conservative definition.
you simply cannot claim that a common usage of the word "american" is being used. if liberals seek to change beliefs that conservatives use in their definition of what it is to be american... then the conclusion points to itself.
i'm unsure where calling someone a traitor entered the mix. certainly you're not suggesting that everytime someone is called un or anti-american the caller is implying treason.