Mc Chicken - Worker who shot at robber suspended - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

hillbilly · 12-31-2005, 09:41 PM

A McDonald's worker who shot at a woman who robbed the restaurant on State Street in New Albany on Christmas Eve has been suspended from his job because of the incident.
Maintenance worker Clifton Brown Jr. had taken a 9 mm pistol to work on Dec. 23 and had it with him outside the restaurant as he and another employee took out the trash shortly after the midnight closing, New Albany police said.

That is when a woman, who was on foot, put a gun to the back of the second worker and then robbed the restaurant through the drive-through window.
Brown pulled his gun out and ordered the fleeing robber to stop, he told police.
The woman stopped but raised her own gun, Brown told police. He responded by firing two shots at her before she continued to flee. Police, who described Brown as in his early 50s, said they think both shots missed their target.
Ron Vanover, owner of the restaurant, said yesterday that guns are prohibited at McDonald's. Vanover said Brown is suspended "pending an investigation."
Calling it a personnel matter, he would not say what might happen at the end of the investigation.
"It's just unfortunate that it happened and it's unfortunate that somebody reacted that way," Vanover said of the robbery and the firing of shots. He called Brown's reaction inappropriate.
"I think that's common sense. Money can be replaced; lives cannot," Vanover said.
Brown, who could not be reached yesterday, has a permit to carry a gun, New Albany Detective Keith Whitlow said. "We don't have any reason to believe that Mr. Brown has violated any laws," Whitlow said. "It's up to McDonald's to decide" what happens with the employee, he added.
Whitlow said that he's "not overly enthused about untrained individuals engaging in stuff like that," but that once the robber raised her gun, Brown "was in jeopardy" and had a right to defend himself.

G5_Todd · 01-01-2006, 01:41 PM

rules are rules.....as my father would say

ziadel · 01-01-2006, 03:21 PM

well I'll never eat at mcDonalds again.

feelgood · 01-01-2006, 05:31 PM

Company rules states that workers are not to bring weapons including guns to their shift. So, why did he do it anyways? I'm guessing sheer stupidity and out of fear for his own life but that's life. You either choose your own safety or your ability to follow company rules.

hillbilly, rule of thumb around here is to post an article AND your own opinion.

Fire · 01-01-2006, 11:59 PM

I now own a public store front- my employees are encouraged to bring a weapon, provided that it is a legal one and they have the nescessary permits and training- the rule with us is to always surrender the money, or whatever else they belive will keep them safe- should they feel that that is not going to work, however, they are encouraged to defend themselves in any manner they deem nescessary to protect their lives... we also are bucking the trend in our area by welcoming legaly concealed weapons carried by our patrons.... I am not sure that I would want just anyone from Mickey dees carrying, but this guy was carrying legally,- Its a shame when lawyers are allowed to dictate corporate policy in that fashion.. has the NRA a position on this case?

Suave · 01-02-2006, 01:28 AM

I see no problem with him facing disciplinary action. It's the company's rules, their organization, and their property. If a company has a dress code, do you show up to work naked?

hrdwareguy · 01-02-2006, 08:01 AM

I have no problem with him facing disciplinary action as other have said.

What I do have a problem with is the story says, he told the fleeing suspect to stop. The fleeing suspect then had to turn around and raise her gun. If the suspect is fleeing at this point, he is in no way in feer of his life. This guy wanted to be a hero.

Dragonknight · 01-02-2006, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hrdwareguy

This guy wanted to be a hero.

Yeah totally agree with hrdwareguy on this one. This guy had no reason to put those he worked with or himself in danger for company money. If the perp would have shot him and got pissed and when in and killed everyone else that would have been horrible. If your carrying a consealed and your not some type of law inforcement, I feel you should be only be carring for self defense. There was NO reason to draw on a fleeing thief.

MSD · 01-04-2006, 11:30 AM

I feel that people should be allowed to carry anyhwere not prohibited by law as long as they're licensed, but asinine company policy is asinine company policy.

This guy was pretty clearly trying to be a hero rather than acting in self-defense, but in general, if a robber points a gun at me, he has indicated willingness to kill me, and I want to have the option of using all means necessary to prevent him from doing that. If I can give him the money and let the police get him with no danger to me or those in my presence, that's fine, but if I assess the situation and determine that he is ana immediate threat to myself and those around me, I should have the option of making sure that the last person he ever thratens is one who's able to fight back.

Bill O'Rights · 01-04-2006, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feelgood

Company rules states that workers are not to bring weapons including guns to their shift. So, why did he do it anyways?

Bad part of town?

Quote:

Originally Posted by hrdwareguy

If the suspect is fleeing at this point, he is in no way in feer of his life. This guy wanted to be a hero.

I would say that you are dead on with that statement.

I have 0 problem with law abiding citizens carrying. Concealed, or otherwise. However...McDonald's, as company policy, has dictated that their employees are not permited to carry weapons. That is within their right. Mr. Brown violated that policy and should therefore expect nothing less than appropriate disciplinary action to be handed down.

hillbilly · 01-04-2006, 10:51 PM

feelgood said
"hillbilly, rule of thumb around here is to post an article AND your own opinion."

Sorry, new here.
I think it sucks he lost his job
I think he needs more range time.
I think Mc D just told all the criminals " Rob us we will GIVE you the cash and please don't shoot me."

I can understand McDonald's stance on this, they would be held responsible if anyone would have gotten hurt, not the shooter (has no money worth suing for) but was an employee of Micky D's and on their property acting as security at that moment. He was the only one that fired any shots.

I think this situation opens up a can of worms, what if the employee had accidentally shot an innocent bystander with the two Shots that "missed"? Not every one that carries a gun is as good a shot

I still think it sucks.

12-31-2005, 09:41 PM	#1 (permalink)
hillbilly Upright Location: usa	Mc Chicken - Worker who shot at robber suspended A McDonald's worker who shot at a woman who robbed the restaurant on State Street in New Albany on Christmas Eve has been suspended from his job because of the incident. Maintenance worker Clifton Brown Jr. had taken a 9 mm pistol to work on Dec. 23 and had it with him outside the restaurant as he and another employee took out the trash shortly after the midnight closing, New Albany police said. That is when a woman, who was on foot, put a gun to the back of the second worker and then robbed the restaurant through the drive-through window. Brown pulled his gun out and ordered the fleeing robber to stop, he told police. The woman stopped but raised her own gun, Brown told police. He responded by firing two shots at her before she continued to flee. Police, who described Brown as in his early 50s, said they think both shots missed their target. Ron Vanover, owner of the restaurant, said yesterday that guns are prohibited at McDonald's. Vanover said Brown is suspended "pending an investigation." Calling it a personnel matter, he would not say what might happen at the end of the investigation. "It's just unfortunate that it happened and it's unfortunate that somebody reacted that way," Vanover said of the robbery and the firing of shots. He called Brown's reaction inappropriate. "I think that's common sense. Money can be replaced; lives cannot," Vanover said. Brown, who could not be reached yesterday, has a permit to carry a gun, New Albany Detective Keith Whitlow said. "We don't have any reason to believe that Mr. Brown has violated any laws," Whitlow said. "It's up to McDonald's to decide" what happens with the employee, he added. Whitlow said that he's "not overly enthused about untrained individuals engaging in stuff like that," but that once the robber raised her gun, Brown "was in jeopardy" and had a right to defend himself. Last edited by hillbilly; 12-31-2005 at 10:21 PM..

01-01-2006, 01:41 PM	#2 (permalink)
G5_Todd Junkie Location: Reichstag	rules are rules.....as my father would say __________________ "....and when you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." -General Franks

01-01-2006, 03:21 PM	#3 (permalink)
ziadel Myrmidon Location: In the twilight and mist.	well I'll never eat at mcDonalds again. __________________ Ron Paul '08 Vote for Freedom Go ahead and google Dr. Ron Paul. You'll like what you read.

01-01-2006, 11:59 PM	#5 (permalink)
Fire Warrior Smith Location: missouri	I now own a public store front- my employees are encouraged to bring a weapon, provided that it is a legal one and they have the nescessary permits and training- the rule with us is to always surrender the money, or whatever else they belive will keep them safe- should they feel that that is not going to work, however, they are encouraged to defend themselves in any manner they deem nescessary to protect their lives... we also are bucking the trend in our area by welcoming legaly concealed weapons carried by our patrons.... I am not sure that I would want just anyone from Mickey dees carrying, but this guy was carrying legally,- Its a shame when lawyers are allowed to dictate corporate policy in that fashion.. has the NRA a position on this case? __________________ Thought the harder, Heart the bolder, Mood the more as our might lessens

01-02-2006, 01:28 AM	#6 (permalink)
Suave Twitterpated Location: My own little world (also Canada)	I see no problem with him facing disciplinary action. It's the company's rules, their organization, and their property. If a company has a dress code, do you show up to work naked? __________________ "Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are even incapable of forming such opinions." - Albert Einstein "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato

01-01-2006, 05:31 PM	#4 (permalink)
feelgood Free Mars! Location: I dunno, there's white people around me saying "eh" all the time	Company rules states that workers are not to bring weapons including guns to their shift. So, why did he do it anyways? I'm guessing sheer stupidity and out of fear for his own life but that's life. You either choose your own safety or your ability to follow company rules. hillbilly, rule of thumb around here is to post an article AND your own opinion.

01-02-2006, 08:01 AM	#7 (permalink)
hrdwareguy "Officer, I was in fear for my life" Location: Oklahoma City	I have no problem with him facing disciplinary action as other have said. What I do have a problem with is the story says, he told the fleeing suspect to stop. The fleeing suspect then had to turn around and raise her gun. If the suspect is fleeing at this point, he is in no way in feer of his life. This guy wanted to be a hero. __________________ Gun Control is hitting what you aim at Aim for the TFP, Donate Today

01-04-2006, 11:30 AM	#9 (permalink)
MSD The sky calls to us ... Super Moderator Location: CT	I feel that people should be allowed to carry anyhwere not prohibited by law as long as they're licensed, but asinine company policy is asinine company policy. This guy was pretty clearly trying to be a hero rather than acting in self-defense, but in general, if a robber points a gun at me, he has indicated willingness to kill me, and I want to have the option of using all means necessary to prevent him from doing that. If I can give him the money and let the police get him with no danger to me or those in my presence, that's fine, but if I assess the situation and determine that he is ana immediate threat to myself and those around me, I should have the option of making sure that the last person he ever thratens is one who's able to fight back.

01-04-2006, 10:51 PM	#11 (permalink)
hillbilly Upright Location: usa	feelgood said "hillbilly, rule of thumb around here is to post an article AND your own opinion." Sorry, new here. I think it sucks he lost his job I think he needs more range time. I think Mc D just told all the criminals " Rob us we will GIVE you the cash and please don't shoot me." I can understand McDonald's stance on this, they would be held responsible if anyone would have gotten hurt, not the shooter (has no money worth suing for) but was an employee of Micky D's and on their property acting as security at that moment. He was the only one that fired any shots. I think this situation opens up a can of worms, what if the employee had accidentally shot an innocent bystander with the two Shots that "missed"? Not every one that carries a gun is as good a shot I still think it sucks.