Yet another networking question. - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

glytch · 12-15-2003, 03:25 PM

Okay, so I just bought a new house (yay for me and all). Anyway, I would greatly like to install ethernet jacks into my walls. There is ample space under the house for the installation, and I'm pretty confident I could bumble my way through it. I already have everything I need as far as the actual network goes, I just need to know how to go about installing the system. I'll need some special CAT5, right? Basically what I'm most confused about is how you run from the inside of the wall to the inside of another. Has anyone ever read a guide about this sort of thing, or know anything about it?

I apologize if this post was rather hard to understand, as I'm not quite sure how to word what I'm looking for. I hope it's semi-intellegible though. Any help I can get would be awesome, thanks in advance!

sailor · 12-15-2003, 04:28 PM

When we ran ours, we bought a bunch of 100 foot CAT5 cables. We then went into the attic and ran them down through the walls. You dont need some special cable, you just cut the ends off and solder the bare wires into the connector in the wall plug. Works pretty well. Takes a pretty good eye, but its not overly hard.

To get from wall to wall, you basically have to run the wire through the ceiling or subfloor. Not an easy task. Find out if the house has wiring conduits. When we build our house, we had the plumber install piping (3", IIRC) running from attic to cieling in several places that was open on the ends and has a hole cut for easy access. The pipes are placed in out of the way places (no gaping holes in the living room wall

). That way, when we want to run wires for this (or cable, or whatever), it is easy to drop the wires down through these pipes.

Wiring isnt the easiest task, it takes a good bit of time and patience. Once done, however, it is very nice. If you are only doing this for internet, and dont want to go through the trouble of wiring, you could always go wireless.

glytch · 12-15-2003, 04:38 PM

Thank you for your help, sailor420. I think I'm going to give this a try tomorrow.

rubicon · 12-15-2003, 05:08 PM

If you'd rather save yourself the time and trouble of running cable, try Ethernet over Power. They're about $100 per outlet but it's literally plug and play. From what I hear at least.

j8ear · 12-15-2003, 05:38 PM

I have done a number of these. Essentially it boils down to the right tools for the right job. I would avoid soldering and instead employ a punch down tool. Most rj-45 modular jacks come with a simple plastic punch down tool which is perfect for the job, and the jacks themselves are color coded so you can easily punch things down to the correct specifications.

You do not need 'special' cat-5 just any cat 5 will do and you will also need a patch panel at the location where all of your wall jacks originate. You can get a 500 ft spool of it for 40 bucks at home depot. In fact you can get everything you need at the home depot. Wall plates, rj-45 modular outlets, in wall or surface mount boxes, patch panel, and tools, to crimp, punch down, and test your installation. Since the originating end of your room jacks will need to be patched into a hub or switch, you will probably save quite a bit by making your own patch cables.

Check the datacomm section.

Ask away, I shuold be able to walk you through the entire installation.

-bear

glytch · 12-15-2003, 05:40 PM

Nah, I think I'd rather run the cable. It's much cheaper and faster, plus I would like to get the experience of doing it. Thanks for the suggestion, though

Vanquish · 12-15-2003, 05:53 PM

I may be stating the obvious, but before you start, make sure you know you are not going to be drilling into a Pipe or a power wire. Even just baring a power wire is a serious fire risk. Not to mention the fact you could get lifted. And I am sure you wouldn't want a hole in a sewer / water pipe in your house.

In fact it is considered illegal to run wire like that yourself, not that everyone doesn't do it, but if you screw up I dont know if insurance would be willing to pay for something like that or not.

I wired my room like this and I found the only major thing I needed was a nice 50' fish tape and a steady hand for the wires.
Good luck

sandeep · 12-15-2003, 06:04 PM

you can also purchase spools of cat5 that come with crimpers and rj45 connectors. if you need a lot of cableing, you may be better off going that route.

and you'll want to look into shielded vs. non-sheilded cables. if you're going to run it through a house where you aren't sure of the locations of electro magnetic sources, sheilded may be the way to go.

One thing about wiring anything is, it's always better to check twice while you're doing it, than to go back through and trouble shoot a bad connection later on.

good luck with that

j8ear · 12-15-2003, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Vanquish
In fact it is considered illegal to run wire like that yourself...

Repsectfully sir, that is one hundred percent false in every jurisdiction I have serviced.

Concur on the precautions otherwise.

-bear

sandeep · 12-15-2003, 06:26 PM

different cities have different bylaws about where you can dig around outside of your house, but i've never heard of anything that prohibits driling inside your home.

Vanquish · 12-15-2003, 06:34 PM

Wow thats totally different from here. I mean everyone does it, but by the book your not allowed. Sorry for assuming that its the same most places. Thanks for informing me of this LOL

edit:
Just to let you know the reasons for me thinking of this....My Uncle is an electrician and he said that he was supposed to be the one doing all wireing behind walls and places that were not directly visable. I think I am going to go see if I can find out if he knew what he was talking about or if he doesnt.

glytch · 12-15-2003, 09:50 PM

Thanks for the explaination j8ear, I'll keep you updated if I have any problems. Also, I'd like to thank everyone that has put in some comments on this thread, I honestly didn't think it was going to go anywhere.

As far as the wiring is concerned, I'm more than likely going to get my father to help me out, as he is a retired electrician/contractor. I've made note of all the recommended items (which I owe a big thank you for, I wouldn't have known to get some of this stuff), and will be heading to Home Depot with my list tomorrow. Wish me luck!

Mephisto2 · 12-15-2003, 10:00 PM

Why not just go wireless?

Mr Mephisto

Sion · 12-16-2003, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Vanquish
Wow thats totally different from here. I mean everyone does it, but by the book your not allowed. Sorry for assuming that its the same most places. Thanks for informing me of this LOL

edit:
Just to let you know the reasons for me thinking of this....My Uncle is an electrician and he said that he was supposed to be the one doing all wireing behind walls and places that were not directly visable. I think I am going to go see if I can find out if he knew what he was talking about or if he doesnt.

vanq: what your uncle is talking about is electrical power supply wiring, ie wiring that carries supply current, as opposed to just carrying signals, like cable tv, phone, internet, speaker wires, etc. essentially it boils down to whether the wires in question have the capability to kill you if you do it wrong.

also, depending on the area, there may or may not be a legal requirement that a certified electrician does the wiring. however, in all cases, wiring of that sort is supposed to be inspected by a certified electrician/inspector (often the power company will send out someone to inspect the setup before they will ever hook you into the grid.)

glytch · 12-16-2003, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr Mephisto
Why not just go wireless?

I already have all of the equipment for a 'wired' network. Going wireless for EVERY networked piece of equipment in my house would be well more than I would be able to spend. Also, this is something that I have been wanting to do for quite some time, and it will be a good learning experience for me and helpful at work (I'm going to school for Networking, then later Network Security).

Thanks for the input though.

Vanquish · 12-16-2003, 11:22 AM

I spoke with him today and you hit it dead on there Sion LOL wow I feel like a noob. Anyway yeah he has to do it if it deals with wires that have a high enough voltage that can hurt someone. But even with normal network wire I am supposed to get an inspector to come in and look at it (like thats gunna happen)

poof · 12-16-2003, 05:18 PM

Check an old MCSE course, "Networking Essentials Plus". It will explain how, and where to install cat5 (you can substitute cat5e). There is a different insulator/outer covering required if you are going to utilise ducts as a conduit.

Just crimp with a quality tool and leave the soldering to a plumber. When you use a wood bit to ream the hole, or use the existing one, make sure your contractor knows what is going on. Our contracter was understanding and even helpful about advising me on running the cables and the smoothest way to route them.

Make sure you have a definite topology that allows for options down the road. Run bunches of cable now, it will be a pain in the <strike>marriage</strike> neck when you try and tear up a wall later.

But, you will prefer the somewhat slower, more flexible wireless by then anyway.

12-15-2003, 03:25 PM	#1 (permalink)
glytch I am not permanent. Location: Tennessee	Yet another networking question. Okay, so I just bought a new house (yay for me and all). Anyway, I would greatly like to install ethernet jacks into my walls. There is ample space under the house for the installation, and I'm pretty confident I could bumble my way through it. I already have everything I need as far as the actual network goes, I just need to know how to go about installing the system. I'll need some special CAT5, right? Basically what I'm most confused about is how you run from the inside of the wall to the inside of another. Has anyone ever read a guide about this sort of thing, or know anything about it? I apologize if this post was rather hard to understand, as I'm not quite sure how to word what I'm looking for. I hope it's semi-intellegible though. Any help I can get would be awesome, thanks in advance! __________________ If you're flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit. - Mitch Hedberg

12-15-2003, 04:28 PM	#2 (permalink)
sailor beauty in the breakdown Location: Chapel Hill, NC	When we ran ours, we bought a bunch of 100 foot CAT5 cables. We then went into the attic and ran them down through the walls. You dont need some special cable, you just cut the ends off and solder the bare wires into the connector in the wall plug. Works pretty well. Takes a pretty good eye, but its not overly hard. To get from wall to wall, you basically have to run the wire through the ceiling or subfloor. Not an easy task. Find out if the house has wiring conduits. When we build our house, we had the plumber install piping (3", IIRC) running from attic to cieling in several places that was open on the ends and has a hole cut for easy access. The pipes are placed in out of the way places (no gaping holes in the living room wall ). That way, when we want to run wires for this (or cable, or whatever), it is easy to drop the wires down through these pipes. Wiring isnt the easiest task, it takes a good bit of time and patience. Once done, however, it is very nice. If you are only doing this for internet, and dont want to go through the trouble of wiring, you could always go wireless. __________________ "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." --Plato

12-15-2003, 04:38 PM	#3 (permalink)
glytch I am not permanent. Location: Tennessee	Thank you for your help, sailor420. I think I'm going to give this a try tomorrow. __________________ If you're flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit. - Mitch Hedberg

12-15-2003, 05:08 PM	#4 (permalink)
rubicon Stop. Think. Question. Location: Redondo Beach, CA	If you'd rather save yourself the time and trouble of running cable, try Ethernet over Power. They're about $100 per outlet but it's literally plug and play. From what I hear at least. __________________ How you do anything is how you do everything.

12-15-2003, 05:38 PM	#5 (permalink)
j8ear Gentlemen Farmer Location: Middle of nowhere, Jersey	I have done a number of these. Essentially it boils down to the right tools for the right job. I would avoid soldering and instead employ a punch down tool. Most rj-45 modular jacks come with a simple plastic punch down tool which is perfect for the job, and the jacks themselves are color coded so you can easily punch things down to the correct specifications. You do not need 'special' cat-5 just any cat 5 will do and you will also need a patch panel at the location where all of your wall jacks originate. You can get a 500 ft spool of it for 40 bucks at home depot. In fact you can get everything you need at the home depot. Wall plates, rj-45 modular outlets, in wall or surface mount boxes, patch panel, and tools, to crimp, punch down, and test your installation. Since the originating end of your room jacks will need to be patched into a hub or switch, you will probably save quite a bit by making your own patch cables. Check the datacomm section. Ask away, I shuold be able to walk you through the entire installation. -bear __________________ It's alot easier to ask for forgiveness then it is to ask for permission.

12-15-2003, 05:40 PM	#6 (permalink)
glytch I am not permanent. Location: Tennessee	Nah, I think I'd rather run the cable. It's much cheaper and faster, plus I would like to get the experience of doing it. Thanks for the suggestion, though __________________ If you're flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit. - Mitch Hedberg

12-15-2003, 05:53 PM	#7 (permalink)
Vanquish Insane Location: Truro, Nova Scotia	I may be stating the obvious, but before you start, make sure you know you are not going to be drilling into a Pipe or a power wire. Even just baring a power wire is a serious fire risk. Not to mention the fact you could get lifted. And I am sure you wouldn't want a hole in a sewer / water pipe in your house. In fact it is considered illegal to run wire like that yourself, not that everyone doesn't do it, but if you screw up I dont know if insurance would be willing to pay for something like that or not. I wired my room like this and I found the only major thing I needed was a nice 50' fish tape and a steady hand for the wires. Good luck

12-15-2003, 06:04 PM	#8 (permalink)
sandeep Insane	you can also purchase spools of cat5 that come with crimpers and rj45 connectors. if you need a lot of cableing, you may be better off going that route. and you'll want to look into shielded vs. non-sheilded cables. if you're going to run it through a house where you aren't sure of the locations of electro magnetic sources, sheilded may be the way to go. One thing about wiring anything is, it's always better to check twice while you're doing it, than to go back through and trouble shoot a bad connection later on. good luck with that

12-15-2003, 06:26 PM	#10 (permalink)
sandeep Insane	different cities have different bylaws about where you can dig around outside of your house, but i've never heard of anything that prohibits driling inside your home.

12-15-2003, 06:34 PM	#11 (permalink)
Vanquish Insane Location: Truro, Nova Scotia	Wow thats totally different from here. I mean everyone does it, but by the book your not allowed. Sorry for assuming that its the same most places. Thanks for informing me of this LOL edit: Just to let you know the reasons for me thinking of this....My Uncle is an electrician and he said that he was supposed to be the one doing all wireing behind walls and places that were not directly visable. I think I am going to go see if I can find out if he knew what he was talking about or if he doesnt. Last edited by Vanquish; 12-15-2003 at 06:36 PM..

12-15-2003, 09:50 PM	#12 (permalink)
glytch I am not permanent. Location: Tennessee	Thanks for the explaination j8ear, I'll keep you updated if I have any problems. Also, I'd like to thank everyone that has put in some comments on this thread, I honestly didn't think it was going to go anywhere. As far as the wiring is concerned, I'm more than likely going to get my father to help me out, as he is a retired electrician/contractor. I've made note of all the recommended items (which I owe a big thank you for, I wouldn't have known to get some of this stuff), and will be heading to Home Depot with my list tomorrow. Wish me luck! __________________ If you're flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit. - Mitch Hedberg

12-15-2003, 10:00 PM	#13 (permalink)
Mephisto2 Junkie	Why not just go wireless? Mr Mephisto

12-16-2003, 11:22 AM	#16 (permalink)
Vanquish Insane Location: Truro, Nova Scotia	I spoke with him today and you hit it dead on there Sion LOL wow I feel like a noob. Anyway yeah he has to do it if it deals with wires that have a high enough voltage that can hurt someone. But even with normal network wire I am supposed to get an inspector to come in and look at it (like thats gunna happen)

12-16-2003, 05:18 PM	#17 (permalink)
poof Psycho	Check an old MCSE course, "Networking Essentials Plus". It will explain how, and where to install cat5 (you can substitute cat5e). There is a different insulator/outer covering required if you are going to utilise ducts as a conduit. Just crimp with a quality tool and leave the soldering to a plumber. When you use a wood bit to ream the hole, or use the existing one, make sure your contractor knows what is going on. Our contracter was understanding and even helpful about advising me on running the cables and the smoothest way to route them. Make sure you have a definite topology that allows for options down the road. Run bunches of cable now, it will be a pain in the <strike>marriage</strike> neck when you try and tear up a wall later. But, you will prefer the somewhat slower, more flexible wireless by then anyway.