Super Bowl XLIII
 

Almost 24 hours and no thread about how the GODDAMN ARIZONA CARDINALS are going to the GODDAMN SUPER BOWL? :lol:

Too bad they have to play the Steelers, though. They were the better team last night against my Ravens, though they needed one ungodly lucky play by Santonio Holmes and an extremely dirty hit on Willis McGahee to actually win :(

Fortunately I've been a Cardinals fan ever since Madden 2003 (I'm a franchise re-builder :p), so I still have a team to root for.

Ungodly lucky? Not so much, holmes is a playmaker.

big joe didnt do shit

that was a totally clean hit on willis

0-3 vs steelers should tell you something

I am a Ravens fan and was at the game, and I wouldn't call the Holmes play lucky. Roethlisberger loves to break the pocket and wait until the play breaks down to find guys. He did it all game, and the Holmes play was an example. Holmes had a lot of open space and good blocking, which is heaven for a punt returner.

Though I don't know actual language of the rule, I have been hearing that sine Clark led with the shoulder, it is a clean hit despite the fact that there was helmet to helmet contact. Clark didn't try to spear the guy with his helmet, and I think it was a clean hit.

The Ravens still had an opportunity to take the lead, but the bonehead personal foul by Stone made it a long field and then Pittsburgh's D took over with a second down sack and a third down pick.

The Ravens' corners were the problem, and after being exposed by the Titans, the Steelers attacked them. Washington and Walker were backups coming into the season and only have started due to injury to the starting corners.


Pittsburgh is favored and they should be. Obviously you still have to play the game and there have been Super Bowl upsets this decade (Patriots over Rams, Bucaneers over Raiders, Giants over Patriots).

I'll be rooting for the goddamn Cardinals. I'd like the Super Bowl winner to be someone that the Patriots (my team) completely owned during the regular season, it would make me feel better about how things went.

I think the Eagles assumed that they were going to win, and were already preparing for the Super Bowl.

It's hard to bet against the defense of Pittsburgh.. but then again, Arizona has been counted out the whole post-season so who knows.

As far as the hit on McGahee goes, it was clean and legal.. just sucks that it happened like it did.

It was legal, but it was nowhere near clean. Leading with the helmet and not bothering making an attempt to tackle is dirty (and stupid for Clark, who was not only lucky he didn't get hurt worse than he did, but if McGahee had the time to make a move Clark would be unemployed today). He's the same guy who hit Welker a couple weeks back.

A legal hit was the block Limus Sweed threw on Corey Ivy on the long gain by Heath Miller. That was fantastic (and hopefully Hines Ward was watching so he knows what a legal block looks like :D).

And Roethlisberger threw the pass up in the air to no one, and got (yes) lucky that Holmes saw it and got back to it before a Ravens player. That play was all Holmes, and it sickens me that the media is so in love with "Ben" that he is getting most of the credit.

I won't argue about Flacco, though. He wasn't that good. And Stone won't be employed much longer.

Like I said, the Steelers outplayed the Ravens. But like the Titans last week it almost didn't matter.
-----Added 19/1/2009 at 10 : 31 : 28-----
EDIT: ProFootballTalk.com - NO FINE COMING FOR CLARK, BUT THERE SHOULD BE

Seriously, its a physical game, get over it.

That wes welker hit was brutal as hell too, but no fine over that. Clark throws mean blocks/tackles, welcome to AMERICAN FOOTBALL!

Go pansify a different sport, football is, and will remain, and should remain a hard hitting contact sport.

"Pansify"?

Dude, I'm a Ravens fan. I love good clean hitting on defense, which is what the Ravens do.

If you don't think the NFL should follow it's own rules, and love watching guys come within pure luck of getting paralyzed because some prick decided to go for the highlight over the tackle, that's on you.

Clean hit.

The head and shoulder hit within milliseconds of each other. He went down low and so did McGahee. They happened to collide in such a manner.

There are plenty of hits like this every week. They both happened to be a full speed and in the wrong angle. Shit happens.

Welker hit was clean as well, brutal yes, but clean.

NFL needs to chill the fuck out with these play-ground rules they keep adopting. NFL players know damn well they are in for a tough as nails sport and hard hits will happen.

It was a clean and legal hit. PERIOD. And a damn good one, he led with his shoulder like you are suppose to and that is it. It is football it is a violent sport, every player knows that before they suit up. Lets stop trying to make this the No Fun League. Some of you act like you would prefer it to be a two hand touch league.

Now about the super bowl, al long as both teams show up it should be a great game. I will be watching and I am sure there will be a few hard hit so some of you might want to turn away.

I'll root for the underdog Cardinals, but the Steelers have been been solid and will probably win. The point spread I'll leave to others who follow the NFL closely.

Yeah right, you're telling me Ray Lewis NEVER has been in trouble for illegal hits? If his helmet could talk, I'm sure it could tell some stories. Get over it. McGahee will recover and your Ravens will have a lovely off-season.

Clark's hit was clean, he wasn't flagged, fined or anything. You are the only one saying it wasn't.

What does that have to do with anything? If he got into trouble over illegal hits, I have no problem.

BECAUSE THEY WERE ILLEGAL HITS! :lol:

And again, even if you want to call it a legal hit (which it wasn't according to the rules, but lets leave that aside for the moment), that doesn't make it a CLEAN hit.

And for the record...

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/6540/helmetcc9.jpg

What does that have to do with anything? I'll spell it out for you if needed... You said "...I love good clean hitting on defense, which is what the Ravens do." Ray Lewis is well-known for delivering cheap-shots. Ray Lewis is a Raven's defensive player. Therefore your statement about the Ravens being a clean hitting defense is questionable.

I've seen the replays. Yes, the helmet hit first, but it was incidental because of the angles at which they collided. As Clark moved forward, he was leading with his shoulder. And I'll go ahead and stand on the fact that there was no fine or flag. Legal hit, period.

Hines Ward is known league-wide as a dirty player. Ryan Clark has delivered several hits that have been at the very very least extremely questionable and likely dirty. Both play for the Steelers. Therefore the Steelers as a team are a group of dirty players.

See the logical disconnect?

It doesn't MATTER if it's incidental. And Ryan Clark hasn't earned the benefit of the doubt as to whether or not it was intentional.

^ No flag, just get over it man. Most everyone agrees it was a legal hit, and this isn't 2 hand tap, just move on.

Ugh...the Steelers.

I'm not much for the Cardinals, either. Guess I'll just be watching the commercials again.

There is a difference in the way that Clark and other hard hitters hit. Players who were renowned for delivering hard often borderline illegal hits, like Ronnie Lott, Rodney Harrison, or even Polamalu usually lead with their forearm or shoulder not their helmet. As i detailed in an earlier post the Welker hit was illegal (and flagged so) and simply because he led with the head so was the Mcgahee hit. It was certainly questionable whether mcgahee was "defenseless" as he was a ballcarrier, not leaping for a catch, but it was close. Anyone who knows who Daryl Stingley was knows that as much as hard hits are fun and part of the game, Clark is crossing the line.
As for the game, i can't help but think that the Steeler's db's are up to the task of shutting down Fitzgerald, which is the biggest key to stopping the Cardinals. I can't believe that the stupid Cardinals with their 8-8 record are in the big game, while the 11-5 Patriots, who spanked the Cardianls like a bad baby, didn't even get into the playoffs.

djtestudo: I don't give a squat about the Steelers or whether or not they are "dirty players" in your mind. I never said that they weren't. I'm commenting on the ONE hit.

But if you are going to sit back and claim that the Raven's D is squeaky clean, then you're just watching them through rose-colored glasses. You're a Raven's fan, and that's fine, (I don't even have a football team) but don't tell me that they don't walk the fine line of what's legal and what's not.

I didn't realize I was.

*Goes back and re-reads posts*

Oh, that's because I wasn't.

Nice strawman, though. Nicely dressed. Doesn't scare any birds, though ;)

Well, I guess that line that YOU typed in that previous post doesn't count? You can pretend that you didn't say it, but plugging your ears and shouting "I can't hear you" doesn't work after 3rd grade. What's next, a "do-over?" :thumbsup:

:confused: Straw man? Hardly. Everything you say ill about the Steelers in this whole post is based on the fact that you are a Ravens fan and you are crying sour grapes over a tough loss. (understandable, but don't make shit up) Your statement about their defense being a clean hitting one just made me literally laugh out loud when I read it, I just couldn't let that go.

so umm.. is thread about a questionable hit.. or the superbowl?? I'm a bit confused as the title of the thread reads Super Bowl XLIII.

Looks like we need a Whiney Losers Forum. Then perhaps someone could start a real Superbowl thread . . . . .

My Gawd!!!! A hard hit in a Steelers / Ravens game!!! I'm so shocked!!!!! :rolleyes:
What's next - overpriced tickets??!! :eek:

And as far as, "Hines Ward is known league-wide as a dirty player," that's just plain bullshit, and you know it. Some linebackers and defensive linemen just don't like it when they get blocked by someone half their size.

In fact, I believe it was one of your team's players - Bart Scott -who said a few days before the game, they were going to try to take out his knee.

Let me join in what you will refer to as whining I'm sure. What Scott said was,

"His time will come. He'll get his... He'll come across the middle one day, and someone will hit him or take out his knee. The guy will be fined and [Ward] will be gone. No one will even care. No one will send him any cards saying they're sorry. Not to that guy... You reap what you sow."

So he did talk about Wards knee, but didn't say the Ravens were going to do anything of the sort. I can definitely see it happening. He is not very well like around the league by his own admission. You can come to your own conclusion as to why.

As for the Superbowl, you better believe I'll be rooting for Arizona.

i was surprised at how effectively the cardinals were able to attack the eagles defense in the first half. someone earlier said they thought the eagles assumed they'd win and so were ambushed a bit by the cardinals early.

the steelers will not be surprised.

i don't think the cardinals have a prayer.

Interesting perspective I saw from Tuesday Morning Quarterback on ESPN.com.

Whenever teams with opposing dominent sides (a dominent offense vs. a dominent defense) play in the Super Bowl, the two tend to cancel each other out and the weaker sides for each team determine the game.

For example, last year the Giants had the defense and Patriots had the offense, but the game came down to the Giants offense vs. the Patriots defense.

So this year could come down to a Pittsburgh offense that has stuggled through parts of the season and post-season (as TMQ mentions, offenses based around your QB scrambling to create big plays have a low chance of success) vs. an Arizona defense that has given up 40-plus points on several occasions (and 56 to the Jets).

I think if that ends up being the way the game plays out, Pittsburgh wins by two scores. However, if they cover Larry Fitzgerald the way the NFC teams did (maybe I should put cover in quotes...), and they really don't have anyone who can cover him one-on-one, I think the Cardinals win in a shootout with Roethlisberger making a critical mistake near the end.

My opinion on the play is different. The Raven's defender had his back turned, which is a mistake. However, it is not that surprising, because as I mentioned in my initial post, Ben scrambled all game until plays broke down and waited for guys to get open. Yes he was about to get hit on that play, but I strongly disagree that he was throwing it up to no one. I think Ben saw an opening at the last second and put the ball in there. Good throw, good catch, great run after the catch. Improbable and fortunate? Yes. Lucky, as if he was throwing it to no one or throwing the ball away? No.

Watch it again. There wasn't anyone within ten yards of where Roethlisberger was aiming when he threw it. Holmes had to reverse course and run back to get the ball, and get lucky that the defender covering him didn't recover in time.

95 times out of 100 that ball is incomplete or a pick, and if Flacco had thrown that pass people would be using it as evidence of his being a rookie.

RB -- i do think the Cards have a chance because if the Cards get out ahead, can the plodding Steelers catch up? The Cardinal defense is up to the task of stopping P-burgh's offense. And yeah, the Steeler defense looks tough, but they played a lot of really crappy offenses: Baltimore x 2, Cleveland x 2, (Bengals, who are just plain crappy)x2, the Deadskins... They did manage to beat the Colts and NE so i'll give them credit for that. They are not unbeatable.

It's a shame the Ravens and the Steelers couldn't have both lost.

This is going to be a great superbowl for my self and my friends.

Old home just a few months back: Pittsburgh region.

New home: Phoenix region.

I mean damn.

Still a Steelers fan and will not be switching to the cards. But its nice to move from one area with such a awesome fan base to another.

There are just a lot of bandwagon Cards fan I've seen out here.

I also think the Cards have a chance. Let's face it, they were supposed to be out in the first round, Carolina and Philly are believers now.

I would have told you 5 years ago that Warner had no business even suiting up as a backup, but without a doubt he proved otherwise this season. And since he's throwing to Fitzgerald & Boldin (arguably the best 1-2 WR punch) that makes for a brilliant combo. The wildcard is Polamalu, if that guy gets into Warner's head, then it's going to be all over but the shouting.

I agree that Rothlesberger is overrated, or at least gets more praise than he deserves. He's a fairly solid QB, but has a touch of Favre's disease. It's a crap shoot whether or not AZ's defense will show up, but even then, Steelers win with their defense.

Should be a good game. I'll go ahead and root for the underdog Cards.

Phoenix: Home of the fairweather fans. And why not? Between the Suns, Diamondbacks, Cards (now!)...maybe the Coyets is stretching things...anyways, we've almost always got one team who is having an interesting season...why not watch the interesting games and cheer the home team?

I just watched it again several times and in slow motion. Again, I strongly disagree with your depiction. I see Holmes in the area. Holmes did not reverse course. He stopped and waited for the ball, but he never reversed course and came back on the play. I would not call it an under thrown ball necessarily, because the defender was so out of position and Roethlisberger was under so much pressure, he just had to get the ball there, and he did.

I disagree with your initial statement about Ben not throwing it up to anybody. It is clear that he was throwing it to Holmes.

Hell of a game.

I would love to come in here and say that Roethlisberger played a nice game, especially in the fourth quarter and DOUBLE-especially considering his offensive line was an embarrassment. I would love to talk about how Holmes channeled Lynn Swann for the game and completely deserved that MVP. I would love to come in here and talk about how Pittsburgh's defense stopped Fitzgerald for most of the game and got one critical big play, which was exactly what they needed to do to win the game.

However, a game officiated that poorly between the personal fouls on that one Pittsburgh drive (the roughing the passer was a p---y call and what the HELL is roughing the HOLDER?), James Harrison channeling Hines Ward and the fact that the officials blew two forward-pass calls (and only reviewed, let alone overturned, one) should overshadow everything else.

Pittsburgh deserved to win tonight. Arizona, however, did NOT deserve to lose.

Stay classy, Pittsburgh.

http://i40.tinypic.com/whbja8.gif

^ It's in the record books man, just let it go.

The Steelers deserve the win, and just because you're still sore about the Ravens sputtering out that doesn't mean you need to downplay the best Superbowl in memory.

Pittsburgh is a physical team, Harrison got the penalty, what more do you want?

Officiating dictates Super Bowl XLIII to the unreviewed end - Shutdown Corn... - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

One I forgot.
-----Added 2/2/2009 at 01 : 09 : 15-----
How about an ejection from the game. That's unacceptable behavior, especially from the goddamn defensive player of the year.

At least Ryan Clark is doing dirty stuff in the midst of plays (if you can really say "at least").

It's bad when even John Madden says a player should be ejected from a game.

Anyway, the game was a snooze fest until the 4th quarter. Pitt probably deserved the win, but I was hoping the Cards' would come back and seal it..they should have stayed no huddle longer.

and now, I'm betting that Warner retires.

i enjoyed the game---it didn't turn out exactly as i expected, simply because the cardinals were only able to move the ball systematically in the 4th quarter.

this, however, is hilarious:

Porn interrupts Super Bowl TV coverage | World news | guardian.co.uk

did anyone experience this?
things this great have a way of not really happening...

I remember seeing an article not too long ago where something similar happened.. something to do with an older man, and then the porn showing up on his tv.. think it was comcast..

I'm starting to think that some college interns are sneaking into the control room and doing it on purpose..

at least..that's what I would do.

The guy should have got a straight red, or whatever the equivalent is.

No 92 who threw the punch on the guy who was already down.

Im not saying that its the worst thing Ive ever seen - but even in a physical game and rough game like NFL, if you throw a punch in a cowardly way like that you deserve to be sent off.

Its a shame, cos it does taint what was up to that point a great performance by the lad.

I watched the whole game, BBC coverage was pretty good, except for the fact that the host called a TD a try a couple of times.

Oh, and I respect every sport has its own traditions - but isnt a bit ridicolous that each team needs 4 players (and an army general!) to toss the coin at the start of the game???

he should have been thrown off so yeah it would be the equivalent of a red.. although in American football, it's yellow flags for fouls.. not cards.

I can only imagine what Frank Fucking Lampard is thinking if he saw this incident with no dismissal hahaha

Almost as bad as this from the same game!


Kind of similar in regard to how blatant it was...

I knew that the flags were only for penalties, but I didnt know if there was an equivaleng of the sin bin (as in Rugby or Ice Hockey) - I've probably seem 100 NFL games in my life I guess, and Ive never seen a player sent off/excluded that I can rememer.

it's a rarity that NFL players are sent off, but penalties just have different yard infractions.. so, that penalty would have been a personal foul and 15 minus yards..

About your youtube post, Bosingwa in a lucky boy to not have a card, and then to not have the FA be able to do anything about it because the assistant ref's report has that he saw it. How can Lampard get a straight red for a challenge that didn't even deserve a yellow..and bosingwa(sp?) not get a straight red or 3 match ban for that shit?

even worse.. how or why in the fucks name am I defending a fucking chelski bum??

That was a decent game. Played almost as exciting as a Grey Cup tilt, except that having that extra down (4 downs) is rather luxurious.

I was watching in Tucson on Comcast at a neighbor's house, but it didn't happen on the hi-def broadcast that we were watching, only the regular-def. It was hilarious watching the granny they got on the local news tonight "I was mortified!"

True, ejections occur more often in college football. NFL players are eligible for major fines (tens of thousands) if they commit personal fouls. The fines have become increasingly more common recently too. Also I think if NFL players are ejected they're automatically eligible for being suspended for the season. The fines are peanuts for most players, but being suspended without pay ends up being a massive amount of lost revenue.

I think giving someone a season long ban for something like that would be too much, but he shouldnt have been on the field lifting the trophy after what he did, and something like a 2 or 3 match ban would seem fair. And stands to reason he'll be fined, but as you say - when youre making that sort of dough what does it mean to you.

I thought Arizona were unlucky in a way because a couple of key plays (the interception that came back for a TD mostly) made the difference in the end, but Steelers did have more of the game.

and to think it is only a game? hehe.

I didn't watch it, nor cared to. But about the roughness with #92, he should have gotten thrown out. there is NO excuse for that type of play.

It is understandable though. To see how the people who WATCH sports get passionate about it, imagine the people who PLAY it. haha

Did any of you guys actually watch the play with Harrison or just listen to Madden? Harrison doesn't even use a clenched fist....all of the hits are open handed, which are perfectly legal. Watch any punt in any game and you'll find players doing the same type of stuff to keep a guy down or out of the play, it's what they're taught to do. By the way, the Cardinal dove at Harrison's knees, which is not legal, I'm sure that added to his desire to not let him off the turf. There has been NO FINE issued to Harrison after the game either. The only reason there was a flag thrown on the play was because the ref thought he was throwing punches, he wasn't. And listening to Madden overreact to that play is crazy, he was head coach of the 70s Raiders, perhaps the roughest, and cheapest, teams of all time. He'd have a heart attack on the field if any of his head hunters back in the day were ejected in a playoff or super bowl game.

On the Steelers: SB XLIII ... Truths, lies & misconceptions

Incidentally, the league saw fit to fine Holmes for using the ball as a prop. And the media reports constantly on how the officials missed the 15 yard penalty. Yeah, the same media that reports and questions whether the league is too tough on Chad Johnson for all of his childish behavior I guess now wants the biggest game of the year to potentially be affected by a 5 second ball shake after the potentially game winning score in possibly the biggest moment of a young man's life. Um, OK. The NHL is so refreshing to watch when guys like Ovechkin can celebrate great goals (while gesturing with their sticks and everything else) and then have a group celebration immediately right after and not only does everyone not care, they expect it and enjoy it. The NFL though throws out penalties and fines. Um, er, duh. Just imagine if the NHL handed out power plays to the other team because of excessive celebration....pathetic.

By the way, instant replay is killing the NFL. Fans can't cheer big plays anymore because a bunch of guys not at all involved in the play have to stop and discuss it while one stares at a screen under a hood to try and come up with potential reasons why what everyone just saw happen didn't really happen. Go watch some of the old Super Bowls from the 60s and 70s, they flowed so much smoother with fewer stops and without TV announcers who agonized and theorize over every mundane detail.

I'll assume for a second that you are a Steelers fan based on your screen name and the content of your post. If not, let me know and I will gladly apologize for heaping such a terrible insult upon your good name ;)

There is nothing worse than a fan whose team won at least in part because of calls made by an official declaring that the rules should not have been followed.

If you don't like the rules, than do what you can to get them changed. But don't act like because you think they are bad they shouldn't be followed.

If in that final drive the Cardinals had scored quickly and the refs ignored a celebration penalty on the Cardinals that could have placed the Steelers in position for a last-second tying field goal, the city of Pittsburgh would have had an armed insurrection attacking NFL headquarters the next day. Don't even try to deny it.

As for Harrison, look at the .gif file I had found and posted. The very first thing you see is a straight downward punch onto the Cardinal player's shoulder. I really have to question if you actually bothered to watch it.

? Declaring the rules should not have been followed? Where did I say that? Just pointing out the hypocrisy in the media. You can't go heavy against the league saying they're too harsh on some guys (i.e. Chad Johnson) during the regular season and then raising complaints about a no call in the Super Bowl. By the way, the refs never saw the celebration that's why there was no flag. Even TV missed it when it happened live. Only on replay was it viewed because it happened so late after the play. Having said that, I think the league needs to lighten up. As a huge fan of football, the games are becoming painful to watch and to listen to with all the second guessing and crying over nothing.





I've seen it several times in Hi Def on the NFL Net's various replays, he hits him with the base of his open hand. Perfectly legal. That's why there was NO FINE. That's right, NO FINE. It's also why there was no open complaints or derision of the play by Cardinal coaches or players after. Only John Madden and those who watch one football game a year and think Madden's word is gospel are upset. That and people who hate the Steelers.

The league definitely needs to lighten up, but that doesn't mean you ignore the rules in place. That's why your hypocrisy argument doesn't hold water; you can dislike the rule while understanding that it needs to be followed. Whether or not it was noticed at the time (and you can't tell me out of all the officials on the field not one saw it as it happened), it definitely lowered the Cardinals' chances for a win.

If Bart Scott did the same thing to a Steeler, he would have been led off the field in handcuffs.

Official review of SBXLIII

It doesn't get anymore obvious than that, the ref is walking away with his back to the celebration. So yeah, nobody saw it. You know what really lowered the chances for the Cards win? Giving up an 82 yard drive with just over 2 minutes to go. Oh yeah, and a 100 yard INT return and fumbling on the final play. And, again, I never said anything about ignoring the rule.

OK, obviously you're not up for a serious discussion. Drop the blind hate and fanaticism then I'll discuss the problems of the game with you. Till then, I'm out.