Women want to walk around topless everywhere?
 

http://orlandoweekly.com/news/Story.asp?ID=4559

Interesting subject. How many women on this board would agree with the right to go bare-nipped whenever you felt like it, and how many men would want to see that as well? Keep in mind it would be just as many 90 year old overweight grandmothers as nubile young coeds, and how many traffic accidents would this cause?

:lol:, Yeah

Here's their website...

http://www.legalfreedom.com/topfree/

Though I am not a woman, I fully support their cause. In fact, I will volunteer my house as a place for the topless women to have their gatherings. Viva la revolution!

It will be far less attractive than any man is thinking right now. I definitely don't think this is an issure of sexuality.

As long as its in the same context as when men do it, fine.

I wouldn't do it all the time, but sometimes i just get sick of wearing my clothes, it's just too uncomfortable. Other times of course i prefer it, but i'm all for equal rights :thumbsup:

It has nothing to do with what they would look like, and everything to do with equality -- why can men go bare-chested but not women? This has always seemed arbitrary and unfair to me.

This would be a non-issue in most parts of the world. We North Americans are way too uptight.

Whatever... it's just skin. Although the adjustment will be hardest...ahem, most difficult for pubescent boys.

hmmm....
hopefully it doesnt backfire and cause men to have to keep themselves covored too... i dont wanna wear full body swimsuits :p

If it did happen boobs wouldn't be help (no pun) like they are now.

No need for tittie bars anymore, we see them all the time and they it would become old.:(

Sure. I'd even support people walking around stark naked, if it weren't for the dangers posed by those same people sitting on public benches and the like (I'd never take public transport again :D ).

It's just another attempt of us men to control women.

Personally, I think it would suck to know that a million other guys can see my SO's tata's just because she's hot. But that's just because I'm a possessive ass.

I'm all for equality. Hey, as long as I can see your SO's tata's too, I guess? ;)

I'm for doing away with clothing in general unless you want to wear it. Hey it gets hot in Texas and if I want to walk around downtown with nothing on but a pair of socks why not?

I am all for equal rights and believe it should be a personal choice of whether or not to go clothed in public. If a person wants to be nude I say let them. It doesn't hurt anyone. I would personally be opposed to my girlfriend walking around naked, but I believe she should have the choice of whether or not to do so. And in light of the idea of equal rights, I believe I should have the choice to be able to walk around butt naked if I want to

Ever hear of sun poisoning? From what I've heard it's not fun at all.

Pish posh. I laugh at the sun. Skin cancer you say? Ha!
But seriously I've only heard of that affecting the really young.

They should have the right to do it, but nobody is actually going to if they do.

Women can and have been known to walk around topless in Toronto. A case several years ago was won by a woman wanting to be topless at any time. I wouldn't say its a popular thing to do however, so there's no risk of titties getting *old* and *boring*. I think for the most part, people are just freely flashing now. Win, win. :)

I'm all for it! I have to agree with CityOfAngels about other guys seeing my wife's tata's. I'm a possessive ass too and my wife is the only hot woman in my neighborhood. No fair trade value.

I bet a lot of the tops that would be out are the ones you would rather see covered. Just like a large majority of the topless men are fat and hairy. Yeah fat and hairy women topless.

I'm a little too possesive here too, not sure if thats a good thing or a bad thing tho...

I went topless and nude in Mexico on my balcony. My husband loves to admire me being free with my body, and I think it turns him on to know that others like to look too.

I wouldn't do it, but if others want to, well then... knock yourself out.

for you who dont want to share your s/o's tata's with others....why is it ok for we "women in general" to share your beautiful (even if only in the eyes of your s/o) chests with the rest of the world?

Here in Ontario it is perfectly legal for a woman to go topless whenever she wants.

A woman names Gwen Jacobs was very hot one summer day and decided to take off her top in downtown Guelph. She was charge with indecent exposure. She fought it in court and the court ruled in her favour thereby allowing it throughout Ontario.

It made a lot of noice at the time but has been pretty much a non-issue since. Women have the right but very few, if any, actually partake of those rights.

My wife has an awesome set and I love it when she shows them off, it'd be awesome if she walked around topless all day. Hell it kinda gives me a smile to think about how many guys would be staring at her drooling because she's so beautiful. If some dude goes home and fantasizes about her who cares, everyone fantasizes about someone else from time to time, no harm done to anyone so what's the big deal.

Of course my wife might disagree, she can be sensitive about showing off her body sometimes...

As long as you all don't mind me staring, which I WILL DO, then all power to you. Also, dont' come crying to us when you get raped, because mark my words, if toplessness became widespread, you'd see a dramatic increase in rapes too.

if they want to do it, do it. and for you guys who are saying "i don't want other guys seeing my girlfriends tata's" maybe you should find another girl if she'd be walking around topless with no regard for your feelings? Its not like its compulsory...it just gives them the option.

I doubt it.

Rape isn't about the woman being topless or wearing the skimpy clothing. It's about power. The rapists power over the woman. How many times do you hear about a woman being raped on a jogging path, wearing sweat pants and a sweatshirt. Oh boy, that sure is sexy! :rolleyes:

Woman being topless will not increase rape. No way.

GIVE ME A MOTHERFUCKING BREAK... :rolleyes:

Rapists don't give a crap what statement they're making. They just get turned on my breasts and want to fuck the owner.
I can't prove what I said, but I'd bet money on it.

Simmer down, feminist.

I'm sorry, but i don't think i can trust you to speak accurately on behalf of all rapists. You have no idea what you are talking about. How does the sex crime rate in america compare with the sex crime rate in europe, where toplessness is much less of an issue?

I'll take that bet. I could really use the money.

Wait, are we betting Canadian or US money? Hell, I don't care.

Basically, youre wrong. You're so very wrong. But I don't care that much to prove it to you, so I'm not going to come back with thousands of links on articles about rapists and their mindsets.

oh please....do any google search on why men rape and its always "the need to dominate and control and humiliate"

those same searches will also tell you that the claim of a woman looking sexy and got raped is LAME and not the reason most men rape.

dramatic increase in rape my foot!!

DITTO!!!!!

:lol: Now that's funny... (If you were talking to me, anyway.)

I seem to remember that women in Winnipeg Manitoba won the right to do this about 6 (?) years ago. A woman was arrested for walking down the street with mamaries swinging freely, and beat the case on the grounds that "men get to do it, why can't it?".

On that note, I have yet to see any women in Winnipeg exercising this privelege. :(

Cheers!
Phil

Its just an opinion. You're right, I don't know the psychology. I don't know the mind of a rapist. I have no stats. But I do believe that there would be an increase. I think you all have too high a regard for the human mind.

But I don't think that looking to Europe is a defense of your argument. Especially if you're an American. There's almost no cultural comparisons between the European and Americans. Just because German women or Spanish women go topless without harm doesn't mean anything in North America. They're a totally different culture. We don't share that culture. A remnant might, but not the majority.

If it happened that toplessness was okayed in the courts, I don't think North America would change much. I just think the whole thing is a dumb argument made on behalf of radical feminists who don't have anything else legitimate to argue for. You don't need to go topless, and 95% of women never would if it was okayed. Those who argue for it are just bitter that "the man" has that hanging over the woman.

But you're right. I admit, I don't know the mind of a rapist. I concede that.

Let's keep this civil please. :thumbsup:



Why is it that some cultures have no issues with their women baring their breasts when other cultures think it is better to keep them covered? I believe that if women were allowed to bear their breasts in the United States, we too would soon lose the "uptight" attitude we have over a woman's body. I don't think we should have a double standard. If men can do it, a woman should have the same legal right.

On the Europe thing... I know nudity in general is more accepted there but do you really see women outside working topless on a hot day or just sauntering down the street with no top? On the beach I've heard but not just random everyday.

I have a question: Are you women oppressed, are you truly disadvantaged because the courts won't let you do that one thing that women have been dying to do since the invention of the cantilevered bra - bare your breasts?
Is this really holding you back? Is it making you less of a woman because you don't have the fundamental freedom to show the world your tits? WOuld you feel more complete if you would tan your breasts at the beach, or garden with your boobs out?

Is it going to make a difference in the world for women if this mighty victory is won?
Also, what percentage of women, lets say American women really really care about this? Enough to make it an actual issue???

These are just a few questions that I, an ignorant, unlearned man, has about women.

This is exactly how I feel. Anytime my wife wants to show off, I am all for it. She is stunningly beautiful and it really does it for me to know other guys are looking at her. And since it has always done something for her self-confidence as well it is a win-win with no downside. :thumbsup:

To heck with freedom and its accompanying nudity. I would prefer it be legally mandated that women must wear bras that fit.

Most women wear bras that either don't support what they have or are so small that the women look like they have six breasts. Good bras can make average breasts look spectacular. I prefer "spectacular" (and my imagination) to having to face the ugly truth.

thales has a great point there, most women are not wearing the correct size bra. I'm sure I'm not actually!

A friend of mine has fairly sizeable breasts. She claims to be a 36C. She got measured once and the woman found her to be a 36DD. Well, my friend just will not wear that sized bra. Although the 36DD bra will most likely make her look better.

But uhh, yeah... I don't see why women shouldn't go around topless if they'd like. Stupid puritanical society that we live in anyway.

This was uncalled for, and I do not want to see such posts again.

Daval | Supermoderator

Smackdown!

Your friend isn't single by chance is she? :lol:

Yee gods! The Orange text was also uncalled for! My eyes! :crazy:

Cool! That's exactly how my husband and I are too! :cool:

I like to do nice big type when I get my mod-stick out.
Leaves an impression.
Daval

i used to walk around topless when i got my first apt... mainly just to show my independence and my freedom to do whatever i choose... but with 2 kids the topless days are long gone.. sniff... sniff... pitty party for me... lol

I think the biggest opponent to this would be the adult industry. If it was out there all the time, what would be the big deal? Other than the fact that day in and day out we'd see about 95% old withered ones, their business might actually go up.

I predict a increase in either adult videos or hot pokers if this passed.

Having been to the topless beaches of Europe, and the nude beaches of Croatia....after a short while, it's no thing. The first 14-15 year old girls you see are a little strange--I shouldn'be be looking at that. But soon you just don't care.

And think of a public bus. Nekkid. All ages, all types. That's a nude beach.

This has been legal in the province of Ontario for about 8 years now:

http://www.fcn.ca/Gwen.html
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill...o/ontario.html
http://www.law.ualberta.ca/alri/ulc/criminal/enude.htm
http://www.cbsc.ca/english/decisions...98/980220g.htm

There are local by-laws in certain municipalities of course.

Who cares. If they want to go topless, so be it.

She's single, but believe me, she's not worth the trouble! :lol:

Add me to the bet!

Yes because in southern Europe where women are frequently found topless... Rape is at an all time high!

/end sarcasm

I dissagree whit ya grace it wouldnt cause more rape because for a rapist it isnt about the sex its about the controll most rapist pick women because they are usually easier targets there are men out there that have been raped also you just dont hear about it as much

I think if women were walking around topless all the time, boobs would lose their appeal. Not to mention premature sagging...

If women want to go topless so be it, its not like most people will or that it would actually harm people, heck seeing naked breasts and stuff may actually be good for people as there is currently a good deal of stigma attatched to the human body... ok some might not be as pretty as others but if its there all the time you want it less, heck "fully clothed" might become the next fetish.

http://www.asstr.org/~caultron/adam-nis-wk1-pre.html is a story someone wrote where nudity has become the fashion, after all STDs, including AIDS, have been cured. It's a bit weird, and I haven't finished reading it myself, but the world it paints as background to the plot is... interesting.

On the rape thing: if rapists did start targeting topless women, what would happen? The women would put thier tops back on. The law would allow toplessness, but there would be none. The boob baring women would be satisfied without boobs appearing. I win.

I personally don't believe there'd be an increase in rape. Maybe even the opposite?

You have something against bare boobs?

I read somewhere that bras didn't actually help to prevent sagging or anything along those lines. It's actually just another one of those things people get used to doing.

Anyways, maybe if more women walked around topless us guys would get used to them and could actually focus on something we've been trying to get around to... their eyes. Or maybe we'll just focus even more on the beloved junk in the trunk.

I have a feeling if women get the freedom to walk around topless us guys won't be happy 'till we get a national Mandatory day or week where hot women(and only hot women) have to walk to walk around naked.

God bless the Wonder Bra!!!! :D :thumbsup:

why stop with topless, if were addressing the issue of offending people with our nudity, why can't we all walk round wearing or not wearing whatever the fuck we like, we originally started wearing clothes to keep us warm not because our naked bodies are offensive(well not all of them).

Breasts are for feeding babies and had our societies not conditioned us to believe otherwise, we wouldn't even be having this discussion. My problem is not so much with with women not being allowed to go to the beach topless as much as it is with mothers feeling they have to go hide somewhere to feed their child.

First, I think that women who want to walk around topless should have the freedom to do so. Women should be able to wear whatever they want safely. Being sexually attracted to a rape victim does not absolve a rapist from responsibility. Men the world over are sexually attracted to women. The vast, vast, vast majority of men do not rape. I don't know whether or not women walking around topless would increase rape. I doubt it and I hope not.

I've heard the rape is about power argument many times, but I have never been convinced. (ASIDE: Despite countless google hits to the contrary.)The evidence that leads me to believe that rape is about sex:

1. Rape involves sex.
2. Men are most sexually attracted to women in their prime reproductive years (post-pubescent/pre-menopausal) .
3. Men do not (generally) rape other men.
4. Most rape victims are women in their prime reproductive years.
5. Victims of rape who are in their prime reproductive years have a harder time recovering than those victims outside of prime reproductive years.
6. Victims of vaginal rape have a harder time recovering than victims of oral rape.

My sources are at work and I am at home. If people are interested, I can find the sources tomorrow.

this isn't about being oppressed or winning a moral victory. this about a law that criminalizes women for something that men can legally do. this is about getting rid of another brick in the equality of the sexes. whether many women will choose to do this is doubtful, but for those that choose to they should have that ability without being penalized.

I wouldn't mind being able to walk around that way if I wanted, but I don't think I'd adjust to it straight off...I'm not exactly the most extroverted of women.

But I agree with wnker85 that it would take all the fun out of naked bodies, if you just saw them all the time. The excitement in naked bodies is that they're usually covered and only just peeking at you through sexy underwear...and only come out when they want to play!

Also agree with hannukahharry...it is about double standards.

If topless was legal, I would go topless. Maybe not all the time, but sometimes. After a while, especially late in the day, women get tired of dealing with underwires and bras. I think the majority of women who choose to go topless do it because they don't want to deal with the frustrations that clothes bring.

Two words: volleyball league.

Unfortunately, the wrong ones are ones that would opt to go topless, just like at nude beaches! :eek:

There are no "wrong ones", it's not about what you want, it's about what they want.

Actually, this isn't exactly true. Humans are the only mammals who have permanently substantial breasts. Other mammals have very little distinction betwen male breasts and female breasts, except when the female is lactating. So, they are basically normally flat, and the breasts get larger only during lactation.

Humans, however, evolved to be more upright than any other species of mammal. As such, the primary focus of sexual attraction - the buttocks - was less visible. Anthropologists believe that this is why human breasts are always larger in females than males as opposed to only when lactating.

Actually Fallenangel, I believe it is legal here in bc

sapiens- Rape (90% of rapes at least) is about controll and power over the victim. My source is a criminologist who has over 30 years experience.

And on topic, I agree that women should be allowed to be topless for equalitie's sake.

This is not as clear cut as some groups (which have had vast impact on sociological theory) would like you to think. I have read anthropological analyses which say quite the contrary. And, personally, when I have a choice between a social science perspective and something like evolutionary anthropology which has something physical to base its assertions on, I'm going to go with the anthropological view. One of the more interesting books that I have read in this regard is "The Dark Side of Man" by Michael Ghiglieri, a primate researcher and protege of Jane Goodall.

For a person who hates clothes, this would be wonderful. I never got the reason why men always went crazy over women's breasts. The United States is like the only county that veiw breasts as sex objects more than a feeding tool. All breast are are fat and glands.

If you have any empirical evidence, I'd love to hear about it. I don't put much stock in the opinion of an unnamed criminologist.

That said, I'll have to look up the refs for my last post on this thread and post them. (I'm guilty of posting evidence from unnamed sources as well). I believe that The Natural History of Rape by Thornhill and Palmer and the most recent edition of The Evolution of Desire by David Buss both contain the sources I reference above, but I will find the primary sources and post them.

EDIT: I'm not going to post 'em, but if you want 'em, PM me. The rape: sex versus power discussion that I have been participating in is probably a threadjack.

America is a really messed-up society. In a country producing more than 11 000 porn movies PER YEAR , Nudity is still such a big issue. Its okay for 13 year-olds to watch Violent movies with loads of gore, but whip out a tit at the superbowl and the country comes to a standstill. Sheesh. Yet American women have one of the highest breast-implant ratios in the world. In a society that self-concious about physical appearance, few women would go topless in public anyway, so this whole issue is a non-issue flouted by feminists who need to justify spending their NGO grants. This issue is almost the same as women who label themselves "bi-curios" but would pass if the opportunity ever really came up.

Granted, there is very tiny minority of women who would use these rights, but my guess is that they'd do it with legislation or without.

most of this is mute point as the right wing wouldnt allow it nationally it might happen in the us in local areas but i agree with most of the posts on here so far i am all for it clothing in general should be an option period for everyone

Let them be topless, I say. I really could care less if women were able to. It might even be benificial to the society.

Set them free
 

Why aren't women allowed to go topless. If a man takes off his shirt its because he's hot (overly warm). It is not construed as a sexual practice. Why? because it has become a cultural norm. If women took of their tops whenever they pleased it would become less of a sexual thing and would become more accepted.

If clothes did not exist, no one would feel shame or guilt about being naked. It's only our scociety that teaches us that breasts are for sexual reasons only. So feel no shame, and set them free.

If they go topless I won't tell a soul ;)

i wouldn't mind going topless. it wouldn't be all the time, just as men don't go around without shirts all the time. but topless at the pool? hell yeah. while working out in the yard? count me in!

bras are not comfy--even when they are the right size. i go without one as often as possible. sure they lift the girls up and make them look pretty, but i care more for comfort than appearance.

I don't think there is any big deal in it, like a lot of women would just go bare because the law said they could. If it was a big deal they would already be going bare to help change the law.

In Ashland, Oregon (a town about 16 miles south of me) it's perfectly legal for women to go topless. Unsurprisingly, Ashland is a college town (Southern Oregon University), and is incredibly liberal even by the standards of other college towns.

Despite the legality of them doing so, I've never yet seen a topless woman there. I've heard reports that there are a few "regulars" who like to walk around the parks etc "attuning to nature", and the police have been known to gently try to encourage them to cover up. From all reports, it's a fultile gesture on behalf of the police force as the women in question enjoy the full protection of the law and generally tell the police to go screw themselves.

Well as long as we're all in favor equality, how about this.

It's not considered sexual assault to fondle a man's breast.

How about it, do we want to eliminate that form of assault against women as well?

How many of you in favor of equality going topless are also in favor of equality in sexual content of body parts? If going topless is no big deal because it's not a "sexual thing" then doesn't that commit you to the position that fondling is no longer sexual assault?

there's a big difference between a breast being visual and fondling a breast. being topless isn't about sexuality. a woman baring her breasts isn't doing it to be sexual, just like a guy being topless isn't doing it to be sexual. but fondling a breast is always a sexual action. and if it is unwelcome, then it is sexual assault. (and by the way, if you fondle a mans chest/breast, that could very likely be construed as sexual assault if it is unwelcome, it all depends on how the law was written).

Well the question is: should topless be legal or not? Some places make it illegal for women because women's breasts have a sexual content that men's breasts don't have. They say that's not discrimination, that's just recognizing a social norm that situates the sexes differently.

So you could frame it like this: are women's breasts more analogous to men's genitals because they have similar sexual content and therefore should be subject to the same exposure laws? Or are women's breasts more analogous to men's breasts because they don't have any sexual content and therefore should be subject to the same exposure/assault laws?

Really? I heard about the topless incident, but never knew that it was now legal to go topless in Ontario!
And you're right, it's been pretty much a non-issue since. I have never seen a fellow female topless in the summer here. *shrugs* Guess its not a big issue like some people think.
I don't know if I would go topless, probably not, but it wouldn't bother me if others did. Its no big deal.

Yeah, like all the women on nude beaches are getting raped? Bah!
The only time a guy tried to attack me I was wearing a huge parka, sweats, knee high winter boots (no, not heels) and had a backpack on my back. The hood was pulled up. He wouldn't even have known for sure I was a woman. I was walking to work. Lucky for me someone I knew drove by & picked me up. I really don't think this guy had been turned on by my breasts.
As for the other angle of this story, there are topless men out there with bigger boobs than mine (should I rape him?) why can't I walk around as nature intended?

I think you misunderstood me, if indeed I'm the person you're responding to. I'm just asking people what they mean by "equality". Are we saying that the law should treat men and women's bodies absolutely equally?

I would tend to say yes. However, I suspect that most of the people who think they want equality would probably end up disagreeing with be, because the increased freedom is balanced by reductions in legal protections. And for many people the reduced legal protections would outweigh the increased freedom.

AMEN.

I just don't buy that weak ass excuse of "She seduced me". I'm sorry but I personally am able to contain my desire and i'm willing to bet that the vast majority of men are too. A friend of mine was raped and it completely destroyed her self confidence. She's attractive but she dresses fairly conservatively and is reserved towards men. Her life has been limitied by the fact that her rapist is a fairly active community member and his presence makes her very uncomfortable. I apologise if that was a bit incoherent. Oh, and sorry for the threadjack.

Raveneye, it wasn't you I was refering to, but this wonderfully educational remark.

OK, thanks . . .

:rolleyes: I've spent a lot of time in countries with less sexual hangups than the U.S. where full nudity on beaches by both sexes is normal, for example the Baltic Coast of Germany.

In these places rape is less common if anything. In fact along the seacoast I'm personally familiar with rape is practically unheard of.

And I'll also say that the social atmosphere is very refreshing in these places.

It's really hard for most Americans to understand that female breasts in MOST of the world have virtually no sexual content. Even in some places in many western countries.

Last summer I was watching a news program in northern Germany, and the cameraman walked out on some beach and interviewed random people about some political question. About half the women they interviewed were topless, of various ages maybe 20 to 60. None of them had any problem talking to the camera, no more than any of the topless men did.

And in a beach volleyball tournament the next day, most of the players were changing their suits right on the beach, in front of the crowd and TV cameras. Nobody thought anything about it.

I as an American of course noticed it, and thought, what the hell is wrong with my country ? ? ? ?

Wow, I can't believe I missed this.. I live in Brevard county :D

I don't think this has anything to do with rape...but who knows.

Has anyone read Michel Foucault's The History of Sexuality? It's an interesting look at sexuality and law, but it is a bit frustrating to read. I think it's because of the unorthodox view of world power and sexuality...it's still got some very interesting points, and is from a perspective many of us may not have examined, yet.

I'm talking out my butt...