Fight with the wife.
 

Last night, I'm making dinner. My wife comes home and tells me about her day, etc. Warns me she's PMSing and I shouldn't get her angry. Bad sign right there.

Few minutes go by. Like I said, I'm making dinner, and I see there's a pan that's been on the stove since the night before with yucky burnt egg stuff in it. I ask politely, "Baby, can you clean up that pan for me?" She replies, "Do you need it?" I say, no, just would like to get it out of my way while making dinner.

She storms upstairs. We don't talk the rest of the night, even though she does come down to get the dinner I made.

All day today, we don't talk.

Come home tonight, we kinda start talking again. She asks if I need anything. I say, "A hug." She comes back with "I don't know if you've earned one yet."

I say, "Don't even know what I did to deserve not to get one." She says because I asked her to clean this pan last night, and that she had just gotten home from work, and I wasn't respecting her and she had just warned me about PMSing, etc, and my timing is "always terrible".

Anyway, we haven't talked again since. All because I asked her to clean a pan.

Let this be a warning to all guys wanting to get married. This could be your future. Of course, it has been rather nice to have these nights to myself...

/smack you upside the head/
You asked a PMSing woman, who warned you that she was PMSing to do manual labor? Do you not see the problem here? No matter how right you may have been, no matter how innocent you are, you are the man, you are the husband and you are wrong.

Bring her home flowers tomorrow and tell her you were wrong and try and sound like you mean it and remind her that you do indeed love her.

All will be forgiven :D (until next month)

The point is not to understand the woman. The point is to anticipate the woman. Know what you need to do, not why.

I think I'm the only asshole here that thinks you did nothing wrong. Feelings and emotions have their place but to get upset for this long about the pan is absurd. I've never had much tolerance for women who think that PMS is some sort of 'get out of jail free' card. Being on the edge is one thing but I do think that common sense should prevail and she should get over it.

I feel sorry for you. How often does this kind of thing happen? How long have you been married?

Fuck the flowers, if she wants to be grumpy then leave her to herself. Spend the money on a Quarterpounder and a movie (I go fishing). Let her stay home, watch tv and grumble all by herself. Of course I get the same treatment when I am grumpy.

It works for us.

He didn't do anything wrong - -that's not really the point. It's honestly not about being right or wrong -- this is a woman he's dealing with...

PMS is not technically a good excuse, but you wouldn't poke a stick at a rabid dog now would you?

D
I
V
O
R
C
E

Over a pan!

I'm going to have to come back and answer this later on. I started answering and discovered myself ranting.

Short version is this: What she has CHOSEN to do is a direct and intentional act of disrespect. You need not be unkind, but to tolerate this on a continual basis will allow it to become a pattern that will be VERY damaging in the long run. Eventually it will lead to a miserable marriage, or divorce. Address the issue. Do not allow the behavior to have the desired effect, or it is the same as rewarding the action. Any human is entitled to defend himself against attack, and frankly, I see this as an attack... it's a game we don't play around here, ever, and we've got 13 happy years to show for it.

PMS does not alleviate personal responsability. One is responsible for one's own actions. "I drank too much" = I chose to do so. not "get out of jail free" same goes for PMS, bad back, crappy day, whatever/

Hmm..maybe she was tired after a long day at work and already quite irritable from PMSing. And when she walked into the house you asked her to clean up a dirty dish for you. That was the last straw. I'm sure she was like, "why can't he wash it himself its not like I haven't made dinner and washed dishes." Yes, she totally overreacted. Just try to butter her up. She'll come around!

Does she have a personality disorder?



/relives memories of an ex.../


That is very excessive and uncalled for. You should tell her that she isn't being fair to you. For her to be upset there needs to be two things present: A) prior knowledge that what you were going to do would be a serious transgression, and B) an unwillingness on your part to communicate about it.

She's taking something out on you that seems to have nothing to do with you. Does she over-react a lot to other things? Does she have trouble trusting people? Has being with her typically been an emotional roller-coaster ride with great ups and terrible downs?...

I think more information is needed to understand what is really going on here.

Wow... that pisses me off. I'm not even married to her and I'm pretty steamed. I'm not 100% certain I could survive in a situation like that.

I've never been married, but I'm thinking this sort of behavior, if rewarded, is only going to get worse.

Good advice.

Um I kind of agree, but then again I don't PMS. It would have been a little more reasonable if she could have forgotten about it that same night. Not a day and half later. That was kind of absurd.

At's right.

Let's change the situation slightly...


Last night, I'm making dinner. My husband comes home and tells me about his day, etc. Warns me he's Pissed off and I shouldn't get him angry or he'll beat the shit out of me.


No spouse should threaten the other with potential conflict/violence. The only difference between my example and your reality is the severity of the abuse. You should NOT have to walk on eggshells just becuase your spouse has problems in some other way. I've had gfs that had PMS but they didn't use it asa an excuse. Better start selling shit now, the divorce will be ugly.

q: is there something ELSE that is going on here?

I cannot believe that there isn't something else that isn't being told? while YOU may think that you are innocent based on what you've said you appear to be.

but on it's face, she *still* has to communiate with you, anything short of that, she's being unfair.

You didn't deserve that.

Even with the PMS you didnt deserve that.

Would you mind keeping us updated? I'm pretty curious about how it is going to turn out.

I absolutely hate it when women use PMS as an excuse to treat men like dirt and get away with murder (metaphorically speaking).

The very first thing I learned about women... whatever you think she's pissed at... isnt what she's pissed at.

Something else you did she's still pissed over, but for some reason female-logic tells them to put that on hold and blew up over this.

1) Dont put up with this. She knows it's crap, you know it's crap. Call her on it. This will make her respect you more in the long run... after her initial reaction of getting really pissed off.
2) IMMEDIATELY after sit her down and figure out what she's really pissed at, and apologize profusely, take her out to dinner, and make sure to tell her not to pull crap like this again. Make sure she knows that if something is bugging her to come out and talk about it.

Now femenists here may say I'm being an asshole, but I'm a true gentilman. No one ever said a gentileman ever has to put up with people being stupid.

PMS is not an excuse, it may make things worse than usual but it's no excuse to hold a grudge this long over something so stupid. Something else is the root of this and she needs to be mature and speak up whats wrong.

Bad idea, will lead to a divorce and nothing more.

Anyways... just my $.02

I'd drop the greasy ass pan on her pillow and say "Here, for later."

The day after my (now ex) girlfriend had a big fight over some miscommunication issues she sent out an e-mail to everybody with one of those 'humorous' lists of "What women say and what they really mean." You know the type:

She says: "It's fine."
She means: "If you do it, you're in big trouble."

She says: "You should communicate more."
She means: "You MUST agree with me on everything."

Anyway, this came straight after a big fight where I was pleading with her to not pull that crap, and to say what she means and mean what she says. Not to make me read between the lines and divine what she means. (This was sent out to all of our friends, with my address in the Send To field written a couple of times, so she didn't make it subtle.)

But the point of all this is to repeat one thing that I said and most people agree on, that is, that PMS isn't a ticket to do what she wants. It certainly requires a little more patience from the husband/boyfriend, that's a given, but does not "alleviate personal responsability" as <b>toxic515</b> says.

Secondly, because there is some 'humorous' list out there circling people's inboxes that says what women say means the opposite... it just doesn't cut it. I cannot stand it when women use the inherent differences between males and females to justify bad behavior.

Sorry for that rant.

I think you should still comfort your wife right now. Wrong or not, I bet she feels like shit over the incident, and about the PMS, so you should definately still be there for her. Don't let yourself get stepped on though. When she starts feeling better, that's the time to lay down the rules.

im impressed at your self restraint. I cant deal with this kind of bullshit. I may sound like an ass, but if anyone starts playing these head games with me i call them on it then and there.

This PMS stuff really sucks. For the first year or so that my girlfriend and I have been dating she never had these mood swings. Now I come to expect that about 4-5 days out of the month will be misrable.

Sorry for the rant, I've been dealing with the same sort of stuff - except not so extreme.

You shouldn't have to deal with this. Wait till the storm is over, and she is thinking clearly, then tell her how you feel.

When she appoligizes, make sure she understands that this behaviorable is unacceptable.

Why was she still mad later?

Truthfully this is only a small spat. No real fight. You need to realize that marriage is much deeper and if it is to work allowances need to be made. A dirty pan, how about $50,000 or a brutal attack on an in-law. There are many worse instances.

Worked for 18+ years so far, usually both parties need to cool off and a break is what it takes. Communication is much easier after we cool down. Make up sex ROCKS too!

Speaking as a girl who has had pms.. about 12 times a year for the past twelve years........It isnt a valid excuse for anything.. but on the other hand..I get all foxy about that time..

Bingo. And/or get good at cleaning up the mess afterward.

Yes it IS absurd, but think about it like this: what does it get you to stand there and say, "Honey, that's absurd!". It gets you nothing but more hurt.

When it comes to relations with wimminfolk, sensei ratbastid say: "Be supple like the willow, not rigid like the oak."

Try this: "You're right, hon. I wasn't thinking. Sorry!" Look, that may or may not be true, but you can either be concerned with your righteousness or with your relationship, not both.

You are a wise man, who will be married a very long time.

I was originally sort joking when I made the same sort of comment, but it's good advice. Some things are worth arguing over, somethings are just not. You have to pick your battles, a pan needing cleaning should not be a battle.

i don't think it's right for her to overreact like that, especially to stop talking to you, and to use PMS as an excuse.
but on the other hand, if i come home and tell my bf that i had a bad day, he always tries to be extra nice to me to make me feel better. and maybe that's why she was so upset, because she was missing that concern for her happiness.

I don't know either party, and I haven't had anything close to resembling PMS in almost 20 years. However, overreacting is something I am quite used to in people. It's not right, but it's part of what makes a person who they are.

I have a friend who's extremely high maintenance emotionally most days, that if she's not paid attention to, she gets all sulky and upset. Her husband loves her inspite of this and we work around this flaw.

If I had a pissy day at work, and I walked in the house and said I had a pissy day, (then added I was PMSing) and my beloved asked my to clean a grungy pan that he didn't need to use right now, it was just bothering him -- but not bothering him enough to wash it himself - I probably would have considered bopping him over the head with said pan. (or just said something along the lines of wash it your damn self -- sometimes walking off is the best course of action)

Yes, it's overly dramatic to not talk to someone for two days (then again, my mother hasn't talked to me for 3 blissful months) this doesn't make her a bad person. Is the silent treatment normal for her? It's not exactly mature, but it is how some people get over things -- other folks just yell and scream and others repress...

that's complete BS dude. I love how PMS gets used as an excuse to be a bitch. It's not like guys don't have bad days either...but we don't have an Acronym to title it!!!! If I were you.....keep up the silent treatment...and do your own thing. If you wanna go out with buddies or something.....just go...don't call or nothing. If you get the third degree when you finally come home.....just say hey...didn't want to piss you off cause of your PMS!!! Even after you tried to reconcile she was still bitchy......so whatever....talk to her in week...until than....do your own thing

i can't belive no-one has asked yet.. but why didn't you clean the pan?

I absolutely hate how women use PMS as an excuse to get away with anything. Sure I get pissy when I'm PMSing, but I also know that I'm overreacting, and apologize if things get out of hand, as they seem to have here.

That said, it also makes me wonder if there's something else she's actually mad at, and this is just how the anger is being expressed...

"Anticipate the woman", "bring flowers"..... fuck that. Don't grovel to a woman because she is unstable and goes off at you for no reason. It is her who should be appologizing and grining you flowers.

Don't hate me fellas......

There is no excuse for her using PMS as an excuse as had been said over and over. But, perhaps you could have anticipated this ahead of time and washed the pot yourself. If I have had a bad day, the last thing I want to do is come home and clean a day old pan. I want to sit down, grab a brewskie, flip on the tube and forget my woes for a few minutes. Perhaps she just wanted to come home and have you be the sweet, kind, PMS-understanding husband that you are.

Then again, I am single and have no idea on how to keep just one woman happy. Hahaha!!!

I don't know man, I go through this the same type of thing every month with my fiance'. I can always expect four or five days of complete bad attitude. I just try to stay out of her way. Everybody is right though, you didn't deserve it and women using PMS as an excuse to make everyone around them miserable and on-edge is a giant load of manure. I'd just let her stew on her on until she is over it and enjoy your solitude in the mean time. I wouldn't apologize (You did nothing wrong) nor would I bring it up again. Just try to let it blow over and weather the storm.

What really struck me about what you said is the comment she made the next day about not deserving one and that your timing is always off. It seems to me that she has to take some responsibility for her overreaction to this. You are in a marriage which means both work together. This does not mean that she isn't entitled to let a bad mood put her off when you said something that struck her wrong. What is wrong is her punishing you the next day about it. It appears that something else is bothering her, and this is just a handy excuse.

Why is it that they can use pms as a crutch for acting in ways that they wouldn't at work or at a party if it was at the during the sametime.
This is a way for some to say and act in ways that they know would get them told to smarten the fuck up.
Don't give into the little games and when your told that she's dealing with pms tell her your putting up with her dealing with it and that's even tougher.

Wow... I'm trying to get my boyfriend to understand me.
He does things like you.
See when I get mad at him, all he has to do to make me feel better is to say he was sorry and he was wrong, and then I'm all better some flowers or something new form the store no matter what it is makes me feel better also.
She just wants some attention.
Give her a compliment.

For the question of why I didn't clean the pan, I ended doing it and later yelling in the fight "Oh, by the way, it took me 30 seconds to clean that goddamn pan." That didn't help.

Her way of communicating back to me how she was feeling was later that night we talked and she had a list of grievances of things that have occured over the past few months or so, like the time the trash can was full (she's not PMSing at this point, BTW, and shocking, the trashcan is full. Jesus, how lame do these fights sound??) and I said, in my usual sarcastic tone, "Guess I'll take the trash out, cause I'm the only one with arms around here." That didn't go well either. At the time she didn't do or say anything just gave me a "yeah, whatever, smartass" comment, but this made it onto her list of "This in something the recent past you've done that has pissed me off."

BTW - We've only been married about 8 months and only living together for that long. I think the problem is neither of us appreciate what the other is doing around the house. She does clean a lot, sometimes after me. I walk the dog 5 times a day, she does it once. I do the more physical things around the house, obviously. We even do our own laundry. And, we even have a hired cleaning service, so it's not like she's down scrubbing floors like Cinderella every week.

Anyway, the conclusion: I went to bed early last night, she came up to bed shortly after, and we just kinda held each other in bed while the thunderstorm was going on outside. Today we've barely brought it up, except 2 "I'm sorry"s this morning. And we've been fine all day. Better be, we go on vacation in a week.

Believe me, this isn't a normal occurance though I say it happens now about once a year where we have it out for a day or two. I don't think it's normal or healthy, but we're two very opinionated people who like to be in control, and if there's ever a situation where we feel like that's being questioned or somehow we feel violated, these things happen.

Anyway, I guess this is basically a warning to guys out there who, like I did, forget sometimes that your wife is your WIFE, not one of your buds who you have the ability to joke around with ALL the time. They don't, at least mine doesn't, appreciate your subtle wittiness when it comes to household chores, your relationship, or her appearance. :)

Thanks for your responses. Some were fantastic. :) And I appreciate some of your concerns. You guys are great.

I sometimes get infuriated for no reason like that when I'm PMSing. But I don't think I would let it go on as long as she did. Usually my SO just looks at me with puppy dog eyes and says "why you being so mean!!" and I laugh and apologize.

Something that always takes my anger away is if he holds me. So even when I am acting pissy, or saying something mean out of hormonal frustration, he won't even respond. He'll just walk up and wrap me in his arms and all my anger just melts away.

Maybe you could try that next time before things get out of hand. I don't know that you could have done that in this particular situation, since when you asked for a hug later she rebuffed you. Next time, don't ask, just do it. She may not be able to resist if you already have her in your arms. It's easy to stay prickly when you're not touching. (for me anyway)

Edit: I just saw your sneaky reply while I was posting. Guess the holding thing works for you guys, too! Glad to see you're all made up now.

Common sense says that you should not have asked her to clean the pot after hearing the warning signs. However that does not give her any right to hold that against you for 2 days and not speak with you. Getting a bit miffed could possibly be acceptable, considering the circumstances, but 2 days is quite excessive.

That wasn't PMS-that was control-I get bitchy from it, but I bark and I'm over it. Not speaking is a way to control the situation and the person you aren't speaking to. Good luck.

But as in this case, what if he isn't wrong? She came home in a bad mood and threatened him. In my world, that was mistake #1. Either she wants a fight, or considers him an underling. The smart alec remarks were a bit much ( even though I cracked up, and say almost the same things; e.g. Someone needs to clean this floor up before we have to buy a 4 wheeler to get through the house), but I feel they fit the situation. At no time should a woman bring a list up of our past mistakes. They should address the issues when it happens.

Anyway, good luck man, I feel ya!

Hmm. Quite the ending to the story. This is part of the reason why I'm an advocate of thunderstorms.

On the contrary, my friend. It's extremely normal and healthy. You're two individuals who are grappling with what it takes to live as a "we". My answer above would have been a little different if I'd known the timeframe of your relationship.

You're learning to live together. That's going to require some conflict. It doesn't mean ANYTHING about your relationship or your committment to each other. In fact, that the next morning you were both able to apologize says a hell of a lot more about you.

LMAO see? Everytime a woman is pissed, whatever she tells you at the time it's not that. It's something you did days/weeks/months/years ago that you already forgot about but because she didnt speak up at the time you had little/no clue it was a big deal to her.

That is complete BS. It's okay for her to be pissed off while she's PMSing. But what kind of a psycho bitch is mad because you didn't respect how much of a bitch she was forced to be?

I don't think she has PMS. She's just naturally a bitch.

Too late to post what I wanted but I will say this.
(Some women and I don't know enough to give a fully edu, opinion of all!)
will wait to tell you when something is bothering them. But when they do. It comes out as ranting, they bring up things that didn't have anything to do with the problem at hand.
Men interprit this as an attack. and get deffensive.

I learned this from Men are from Mars Women are from Venus btw. ;)

keep your head up. If you care enough about each other you can work most things out. If you are willing to put in the effort.

I agree, but at the same time I understand his actions, somewhat, because I feel uncomfortable if there's tons of stuff around me when I'm supposed to do something.

Until there's a pill, stabilizer or something to help coping with PMS, people who say "women shouldn't blame bing bitchy on PMS/use PMS as a crutch" should just be quiet.

How happy and accomodating would you be if you were in pain and in a bad mood? Irritability, anger, aggressivness, feeling over-sensetive, etc...

It's okay for her to be in a bad mood. It's not okay for her not to realize it later and continue to put all the blame on you. What some other people said is correct: you need to push back on this one, or when it happens again in the future. She's learned to automatically blame others for her bad moods. You're going to have to teach her otherwise.

Are you my dad? This sounds like the same thing my dad would do to my mom?

I am going to tke this one step further and pose the question-why do men put up with so much bullshit from their women? Too many times, I have been witness to if not involved with men who are married to women devoted to making everyone around them as miserable as they are. They claim to love them, but I must ask-WHY?? What is there, truly, to love about someone who is bitchy, unstable, miserable, possibly severely depressed, controlling and greedy?
It seems that men, more so than women, want some ideal that includes picket fences and facsimiles of the Stepford Wives and can't see what it is they truly have instead. And when they DO finally see it for what it is, they think that by standing by her, things will magically be perfect once more(although they never were perfect to begin with).
It's a well-known fact that more women than men file for divorce and most men, in a recent survey, claim it was a 'total surprise'. Yet, men are actually in a better financial position to leave.
I understand the stance that things should be worked on, worked out and an effort made to preserve a relationship. But if a ship is sinking, does that mean everyone has to drown?
This truly has me baffled.

I'm glad it worked out for you :).

I'm glad it worked out for you. I don't think you did anything wrong at all. I can understand being moody when PMSing, but it is NOT a get out of jail free card. The way I see it, PMS is more or less like quitting smoking cold turkey and feeling all bloated from cheap beer without the alcohol buzz, with a touch of very light food poisoning. Which I have actualy experienced. I understand being pissy and snappy, but there's no point in being a bitch about it afterwards. That's a control issue. I see it as, she knows she was wrong, but won't back down (in a reasonable amount of time) to see if you will.

I know this is after everything has smoothed out but heres my take.


There is no pan.

Key point in this whole scene. The statement "I'm PMSing". This means you: walk on egg shells, ask her to do nothing except maybe eat something only if you made it, throw chocolate her way every 30 minutes or so, find something to do far out of her sight.

Glad things worked out for ya.

My ex and I once had an all out screaming match over snow-shoes when she was PMSing. Ahhhh... the turbulent years....

To every body who has said, I deal with this every month in my girlfriend or Fiance, Don't marry them, This is a fact of life that they have been dealing with since puberty.

As Holo said, would it be acceptable if the situation were reversed and you threatened her with violence.
Every screaming liberal in the room would be screaming bloody murder if not calling the cops if you said "your boyfriend came home you accidentaly set him off and he smacked you around" which in my opinion is the physical equivalent of the emotinal crap of her not talking to you for a day and a half.

My wife and I each have our bad days, there are days where we come home and act grumpy, shit happens you try not to take it out on the other person in your life.

PMS is a factor, like "I got stuck in traffic" or "My boss yelled at me" not a license to be pissy, the cleaning pan thing if your wife was sane should have gonna like this,

Preamble, making dinner, wife home bad day, ask about pan,
do you need it?
not really.
"Honey, I need to just unwind a bit, can I get it later", or
"I'm sorry, I've had a shit day can it just stay there for the moment"

She gets to reiterate that she is having a crap day, you don't get trampled on.

In my house, this would be followed by the person who hasn't had the horrible day asking if there is anything they could do to make the person who's day has sucked feel better.

Of course that's cause as has been said, Marraige is work it isn't always easy.

Ah good grief. ; ) Just suffer it out, and wait for the air to clear up. If it doesn't then don't say shit. lol