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roachboy 12-09-2005 04:35 PM

the administration is not trying to describe a war: they are trying to market one.

alpha phi 12-09-2005 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aceventura3
Winners define history and the terms used to describe historical events. This has been true since the dawn of mankind. I think it is wrong to suggest this administration is doing something diabolical in trying to describe war.

If the mudering, slimebag, cowardous, terrorists win; they truely will go down in history as heroic freedom fighters. In the meantime they are the most vile, evil, scum of the earth.

The first casualty when war comes is truth
--Senator Hiram Warren Johnson 1918

Charlatan 12-09-2005 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aceventura3
Winners define history and the terms used to describe historical events. This has been true since the dawn of mankind. I think it is wrong to suggest this administration is doing something diabolical in trying to describe war.

If the mudering, slimebag, cowardous, terrorists win; they truely will go down in history as heroic freedom fighters. In the meantime they are the most vile, evil, scum of the earth.

As roachboy points out the Administration is hardly in the position of "winner" and even if they were there is no reason to simply roll over and except their version of events.

Furthermore, I was far from suggesting it was "diabolical"... the administration's tactics are no different from any other PR campaign... and like those campaigns they only become distasteful when one realizes what is being attempted (Hill and Knowlton's "The Iraqis are killing babies" from Gulf War #1 comes to mind).

aceventura3 12-11-2005 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlatan
As roachboy points out the Administration is hardly in the position of "winner" and even if they were there is no reason to simply roll over and except their version of events.

Furthermore, I was far from suggesting it was "diabolical"... the administration's tactics are no different from any other PR campaign... and like those campaigns they only become distasteful when one realizes what is being attempted (Hill and Knowlton's "The Iraqis are killing babies" from Gulf War #1 comes to mind).

I am not sure but I think we agree. "PR" is simply communicating one's point of view. If I think I am good and someone else is evil, and I communicate that, perhaps you call it "PR". I call it saying what I believe. Historically the winning side controls "PR". I don't see it as wrong or right, it is what it is.

I will find facts and information to support my point of view, so does everyone else, including the Bush administration as well as those who are agaist his administration. Reality is in shades of gray, but we want to believe we are right and that those who disagree are wrong.

aceventura3 12-11-2005 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alpha phi
The first casualty when war comes is truth
--Senator Hiram Warren Johnson 1918

Interesting quote, but I think the history of warfare suggests that disregard for human life is the first casuality of war. When a group or nation develops a disregard for human life they then tend to do whatever is in their power to promote their point of view, perhaps the second casualty of war is truth. However, for the opposing side, defending life is honorable-even when it means sacrificing life. Kind of a paradox.

aceventura3 12-11-2005 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roachboy
the administration is not trying to describe a war: they are trying to market one.

Can you think of any war that did not require some form of marketing to rally the people. We even had to "market" our involvment in WWII. Yes, against Hitler, where many did not want to get involved, and against Japan even after they attacked Peril Harbor we even had government sponsored marketing.

What is this administration doing that has not been done and accepted before?

smooth 12-14-2005 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kutulu
Unless your intention is that your bomb does not kill anyone, you are a homocide bomber.

Isn't this an entirely different type of bomber :D


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