I'm a Bush supporter and all, but this is just sad
 

http://166.70.44.66/2004/Jul/07072004/utah/181590.asp

Yes, I'm a Republican. But this man should never be appointed to any position.

""conceptions from rape occur with approximately the same frequency as snowfall in Miami." Holmes has since apologized for the comment.""

I can ignore the women subserviant to men statement, because I know both men and women who argue for this. But rape not causing pregnancy... how is he in our government?

*Edit* Could anyone help me by letting me include the whole article in this thread?


Edited by hrdwareguy to fix the link

Somethings wrong with your url....if you hover over the link, you can see that it is actually pointing to "http:///" instead of the address.

Edit: try editing the post and pasting the link directly into the text box. If you just want a bare url for your link, there is no need to use the "http" button.

How are you having difficulty pasting the article?

Article:
Rape not causing pregnancy is.. pretty incredible to be stated...

Are they trying to breed controversy? I don't want to hear about obstructionist, partisan Democrats on this one. I would like to point out that what this man espouses is pretty far from mainstream Catholic thought. I'm not a Catholic now, but I was raised as one and I attended 11 years of parochial school. At no time did I hear anything about the subservience of women (I don't think that we ever covered the conception rate of rapes, either).

oh my good Lord :hmm:

if it's any consolation, we don't think worse of Republicans just because there's some crazy people associated with you :) it does make us wonder sometimes mind ;)

sounds to me like as bad a misreading of the scriptures as that that allows "islamic" people to murder westerners

there're crazy people on both sides dude :( I know the Bible states that the husband is the head of the family, but this *asshole* is giving an idiotically one-sided view of the matter

surely the Public Relations people should have shut him the fuck up?

sheeeit no wonder i drink so much ;)

It's fine with me if that is what they want to believe and practice in their personal lives - but not that they impose such beliefs upon others nor try to codify them into law.

I am missing something, however. Hatch is the voice in the article - not Bush.

As an aside, if conceptions occur so infrequently in rapes, why not let the few unfortunate victims have abortions? Using the rarity excuse is a red herring.

Think I'll go re-read "HandmaidsTale".

Might as well brush up on 1984 while I'm at it.

I find this mindset to be quite disturbing, especially as I know someone who has had a child that was the result of a rape.

Brave New World anyone? ;) at least they get drugs in that one :(

did anyone actually mention Bush? we know he's crazy, but not that crazy ;)

anyone for declaring the value of PI to be 4 exactly?

Actually, Pi should be rounded down to 3.

heheh good one ... i can handle most ideologies as long as the sense of humour is still there ... when the sense of humour goes, it's time to start running for cover

PS: like the new avatar, still disagree violently with your politics :)

When the humor goes, they can pronounce me dead.

awww you're not all bad after all ;)

I am having a Sally Fields moment.

:sniff:

*hugs wonderwench but refuses to agree with any of her political opinions at all*

hmmm did anyone see the topic go by? ;) i'm sure there was a whoosh noise just now

Well, you could always throw out a few "Bush is a chimp" comments.

Actually, no. I can't see you doing that.

nah, time was though ... ;)

now i'd say that he can't be that stupid if he's in charge of the world's last remaining superpower ... the thing was, he pissed most of us Europeans off right at the beginning, with Kyoto and various other treaties ...

Considering that many European countries have not approved Kyoto, that's a bit of a stretch.

I guess Kyoto's got to be another thread :)

back to the original topic, and I'm not from the US so I wouldn't know, but does this kind of thing happen more in Utah than e.g. NYC?

This guy is still a far cry away from the psychosis that Ashcroft has.

There ya go wonderwench, I tied Bush's values and judgment into this thread.

I don't support violence, but if I could punch Rick Santorum in his face, I would. That man is an unmitigated jackass, and I hate that he represents me.

Anyway, I think the title should have been "I'm a Republican and all" but since Bush is the head of the party, that connection is present, though tenuous.

I view Pennsylvania reasonable as a whole. As long as there is a valid opponent to Santorum in 06, he will be on his ass. We won't have to deal with him long.

The state didn't know how off the wall he was when first elected, and he was blessed by circumstance and for his reelection.

He turned himself into a lightning rod since though. He's gone.

Yes, Utah is a very religious state. I believe it is like 75% Mormon/Latter Day Saint.

Some would go as far as to say the Mormons (or Churh of the Latter Day Saints) run the state. Having spent time there I have my opinion but shall not give it as not to upset anyone.

Needless to say it is a very conservative state. Yet, bigamy was legal for years and years and maybe within the last 10 became illegal. So I find it funny Hatch quotes the Bible about husband and wife.

Quote from article:

"I don't think anybody can read this without understanding husbands have tremendous obligations in order to gain the respect of their wives," said Hatch. "You might disagree with St. Paul but there are hundreds of millions of people who agree with St. Paul."

More hypocrasy.

It is also, I believe, 1 of the 2 states where any form of gambling is still illegal, and has some of the most beautiful scenery you will ever see, so Utah does have some positive things going for it.

First let me offer my condolences for having Santorum as your Senator. Being an ex-Pennsylvanian myself, I can feel some of your pain. However, noting that I am no longer a voting resident of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, what in the hell were you guys thinking?!? ;)

Next...yes, I wholeheartedly agree that any connection to Bush, as it relates to this situation, is ridiculously far stretched and, quite frankly, more than a little "Limbaughesque", if you ask me. Bush has plenty enough faults all on his own little time card. I don't see the point in adding phantom issues.

Finally...apeman! wonderwench! You guys wanna go get a room or something? ;)

mad heretical phil: ah, thanks, i thought it was mormonised there ... they have some odd ideas don't they?

BOR: i was overcome by emotion when i found we agreed on something :) if people spent more time finding things they agree on instead of working out where they differ, the world would be a better place

i felt it was an interesting new direction for a politics thread too ... makes a change eh?

So apeman supports more sloppy kisses in the political forum....that's fine, but I'm not hugging Artelevision :)

In this new spirit of inclusivity and tolerance, here are some suggestions for future political forum topics:

Carbon-based lifeforms unite
Rainbows, pro or con?
Who wants ice cream?

Sorry to go back off-topic for this thread, but:

If you look at which countries in Europe have ratified Kyoto, you'll see:

Austria
Belgium
Denmark
France
Germany
Lithuania
Luxembourg
Norway
Poland
Romania
Slovakia
Slovenia
Spain
Sweden
Switzerland
Portugal
United Kingdom

If you check out the rates of acceptance, accession, and approval, you can add in even more. What's more important than the number of nations who sign / ratify is the percentage of emissions each country is responsible for, and whether or not the combined percentage is equal to or above 55% of total emissions. If smaller countries don't sign and also don't pollute (oversimplifying), their signing/ratification isn't much of a loss.

just not letting it go,
Kulrblind

Ice cream?....did someone say Ice cream?

I would give wonderwench a big smooch.....but I am afraid I'd just get slapped. If I remember correctly, that kinda stings.

:icare:

i absolutely agree with anything you say :)

further non-divisive suggested topics:
Richard Ashcroft's garden
aren't little fluffy bunnies cute?
are apples better than oranges?*

heheh

nah, there's a happy medium though isn't there? maybe time to start a thread ...


*CAUTION - may lead to flame-wars

Let's go a step further with that.
Currently 123 nations* have ratified or accessed the Kyoto Protocol. They account for 44.2% of CO2 emissions. If the US ratifies it that skyrockets to 80.3% of emissions.

Russia is stillholding Kyoto hostage with their 17.4% trying to squeeze some Economic Aid from the European Community for itself. Once they fully sign on Kyoto will be possible without the United States. We'll be in it anyway in January. When Kerry signs it.

*There's about 190 countries on earth. Like kulrblind said, most of the small ones who this won't really affect didn't bother to be a part of the process whatsoever.

I wouldn't be so sure that Kerry will sign Kyoto, as it will raise a howl from industry that will be audible on Mars. I lobbied US representatives at the UNFCC COP6 (UN framework committee on climate change, conference of the parties 6) in the Hague in the waning days of Clinton's presidency. Even then, the US was the largest obstructionist in attendance. As the US is the global leader in carbon emissions by a wide margin, this definitely strained the proceedings.

Clinton isn't exactly an environmentalist. Kerry is hardcore environment.
Kerry is one of the original Earth Day Organizers.
When he was Lt Governor of Mass he led the fight against Acid Rain.
He helped keep the CAA from being bastardized.

I have many problems with Kerry, but on the Environment he is truly strong. I have no doubt he will sign Kyoto

Link
Now, he will have many problems with the Senate when he tries to do that. If we're lucky the Democrats can wrest control of that as well.

aha, i thought europe was doing ok on this ... is it Russia that's sort of hovering on the edge of ratifying now?

of course, a lot of people don't think Kyoto goes far enough ... we'll see in a few hundred years

btw i wouldn't worry about the thread going off topic, given past form :)

Russia is also waiting on us. Them signing it won't sit well with the Bush admin. So if Bush gets reelected, :eek: they will be less likely to sign. When Kerry is, they will almost definetley follow suit.