Baraka_Guru

No...no I don't think it's off topic. I see this thread as being about distractions that shield us from horrible realities. 9/11 was a horrifying sight to see as all those lives were blinked out in such a short time frame and on such a large-scale action. A war of attrition has a completely different impact. War weariness is creeping, while an attack that takes out two high-rises is in your face. Also, many view these wars as a necessary response, and still others realize the difficulty of simply calling it quits.

We go about our daily lives as the wars go on. It wasn't so on 9/11.

Distance and daily distractions are a couple of the main reasons why Iraqi lives disappear with little showing up on our radars.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

KirStang

In November of 2004, approximately 1,200 Americans died of murder [Table 2.2](Murder - Crime in the United States 2004). If 122 civilians total died in Iraq in November of 2009, then that's pretty damn impressive. Regardless, with respect to OP's original point. Yes, we're far removed from the violence, so Iraqi soldier/contractor/civilian deaths don't bother us as much as being laid off due to the economy.

The war deaths don't affect us personally, so we're less apt to care.

Baraka_Guru

I'm guessing the Iraqi population is less than 10% of that of the United States. And considering 122 deaths is unusually low, I'm not sure how impressive the overall situation is right now, being that it was three times higher the following month (i.e. last month).

What would it be like if the U.S. murder rate tripled from one month to the next?

But you're right. The removal makes us care less.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

matthew330

I'm not sure exactly what the left wants here, what reaction do they want to see....and from whom? How is this anything more than a another politically convenient opportunity to insinuate that the American military causes the deaths of innocent Iraqi's, and if you support their mission, then you must hate "brownies", a term I'm now familiar with thanks to, ironically, the left.

Where is the disgust with those who are actually blowing up the"brownies" across the ocean (I hope you appreciate that, it felt a little fucked up writing it, but I wanted to make sure you understood who I was talking about)

....and where was your sensitive "disappearing Iraqi lives"radar when this was happening?


Much like the left uses the plight of minorities, both real and imagined, for their political convenience (a fact not so delicately woven into this very discussion), I believe the lefts concern over the deaths of Iraqi's is about as shallow. Because what it really is, is a means to a liberal end 9 desperate years in the making: America shouldn't be in Iraq.

filtherton

I'm not sure what you want here, matthew, what reaction do you want to see....and from whom, but I am pretty sure that you don't know what you're talking about.

Baraka_Guru

Yeah, it'd kinda odd. This isn't about the Left vs. the Right. I thought it was about the media coverage/portrayal of Iraqi deaths.

Making it about the Left vs. the Right is a distraction at best.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

matthew330

...and when you're confronted with the obvious...play dumb. I used to do that when i was 5.

super effective when you know you've got like-minded people willing to offer as much ignorance right standing in line behind you.

Baraka_Guru

There's a difference between my being ignorant and my not knowing what in hell you're talking about.

You're making so many assumptions right now that I'm having a problem understanding your point.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

filtherton

It's obvious that you've embraced this notion of what it means to be "left" and that you've somehow convinced yourself that there are people here who are members of this "left" and because they are members of this "left" they only care about torture and the loss of human life when it can be used as a tool to make america look bad. I mean, really, are you fucking serious? That's probably one of the dumbest things I've ever read.

You know what I'm not doing? Conflating your ridiculous opinion with that of those on the "right." You know why? Because "left" and "righ"t is a false dichotomy. It's a conceptual crutch for those more concerned with political games than political progress.

Seems like you're just salty because you aren't somewhere where you're surrounded by like-minded people. Any one who goes around spouting lefty-this righty-that is more out for emotional gratification than honest discussion.

matthew330

filterton, you may have the last word, don't really care to continue this. Baraka, Im drawing conclusions, I don't see where I made any assumptions.

I'd just like to point out with regard to this:

"Seems like you're just salty because you aren't somewhere where you're surrounded by like-minded people. Any one who goes around spouting lefty-this righty-that is more out for emotional gratification than honest discussion."

The only time you took part in this converstion was to let me know that I don't know what I'm talking about. Would that be an attempt at "honest discussion" or "emotional gratification". At least what I said had some substance, and it was honest.