Because I said so.
 

Why do parents think that "Because I said so" is a valid reason for doing things?

Would it not be more effective to explain your reasonings behind something than to make what they say unquestionable.

I have a firm belief that this way of parenting has helped make me unable to deal with my parents when I disagree with them, beyond retreating from the situation and crying. I also believe that this way of parenting has helped the violent and agressive way that my brother responds to my parents.

They're good parents all around, except for this one thing. But I think it's a big thing.

So parents out there, please explain to me: Why do you, or even, do you do the "because I said so" routine? What do you think this accomplishes?

while I'm not a parent, I respected the statement as far as I'm concerned it's rooted in:

My House, My Rules. If I didn't like it I was free to move out on my own, which I did at 17 to attend college.

I'm not violent nor agressive, and never have been. My parents made those statements to me and it gave me more resolve to pay for my own way as quickly as possible.

If you are a guest in my house, you follow my rules, which means things like dirty dishes go in the sink, don't mess up the kitchen, and similar things. Why are they that way? Because I want them to be and I said so.

I swore when I was 5 that I'd never say that to my kids. I still plan on keeping that promise. I want my daughter to seek out reason behind action, as it is often a window into the thought process of other people. If you understand someone else's thought process, you know what to expect from them in the future and act accordingly. If I don't want my daughter riding a motorcycle (when she's older), I'll tell her it's because one of my best friends died in a motorcycle accedent involveing no one but himself, and he was one of the best riders I knew. I know that they're dangerous, and I can prove it to my daughter. Simply saying 'because I said do' not only doesn't explain why I am saying what I'm saying, it takes all the reason out of my demand. It's begging for a fight, and it promotes the idea that I don't know what the hell I'm talking about.

You know, before I had kids I swore I would never say, "Because I said so".

Sometimes you just get sick of explaining yourself, yet again.

I can only explain to my son why he should pick up after himself so many times before I end up relying on the simple, BISS.

I know it sucks but kids can really be annoying :lol: and there are only so many hours in the day...

:)

Charlatan took the words right out of my mouth. I swore I would never say it. But sometimes they leave you no choice. It is definitely a last resort, and I try really hard to use it sparingly. Even then, I cringe when I hear the words coming out of my mouth. and then I try to explain my reasons again.

I'm pretty stern when I think something should be done and resort to the 'parental dictatorship mantra' quite often. My son questions and second-guesses everything.As stated, my house, my rules. Doesn't keep the kids from trying to get away with stuff, but in addition to 'because I said so', I also have eyes in the back of my head. :lol:
As to what does it accomplish-actually more than saying something over and over..."Clean up those toys!" Why?" "Because I SAID SO". They already know the rules. Explaining over and over and over does nothing but delay whatever it is they didn't want to do, so cut to the chase.
How you reacted to your parents probably has to do with more than one simple phrase.

I agree with Charlatan....I too swore I never would say it...but there are just some times where you open your mouth and thats what comes out lol
Its not a constant thing with me....I do try to explain things....but sometimes that IS the best explanation

My daughter is only two, but I already anticipate saying it.

As has been said already, sometimes it is the only explination they need. Kids need to learn to do some things because they were told to. If you establish a pattern of explaining the reason why they need to do something, they will just learn to question every request.

If needed, an explination can always be given later. This will reassure them that there was a valid reason behind your request. And it will hopefully establish a pattern of trust.

Personally, I think it trains them for adulthood.
"Boss, why do I have to do that spreadsheet now?"
"Because I said so!"

Well put.

There's many times where we don't get an explanation and just have to do something because that's the way that it is.

I loved it when my parents would say that.. I would always reply "And I said no!!" and it turned into a battle..


I was a rotten kid

Now had they just explained things.. I would have been less apt to buck against the rule or whatever I was fighting.

Somehow I doubt it... :lol:

Call me an intellectual rebel, but I will patently refuse to do something that someone tells me to do "because I said so," even going so far as to be violently angry and destroy anything that they or I had created up to that point.

"Because I said so" is a cop-out, and those who use it know that it is. Even those of you who say it realize that you've only said it because you've run out of ways to explain it, or you're simply sick-and-tired of having to explain things over and over again.

Personally, I thrive on this discourse. I will certainly deign that any parents here have FAR more experience than I, and I cannot dismiss their input. However, I absolutely love explaining something to someone until they get it. Assuming they'll listen, I'll explain things 170 ways using props and dictionaries until they understand why something is, how something needs to be done, or why I want something done. To me, being unable to convince someone something needs to be done to the point where I must say "because I said so" is a failure on my part to be an effective communicator. I realize that it's selfish, but I really really wish more people held this view in life. There would be far less miscommunication, far less anger, and far less need for authority if we could all become better communicators.

A case in point. Flash back to when I'm 16. My dad needs the dishes done. I don't think they need to be done, becuase the sink isn't even full yet. "Son.. get the dishes done." "But why, dad? They're not even filling the sink.." "BECAUSE I SAID SO!!!"

My minds eye just choked him to death and broke all of the dishes all over the floor, but--back in the real world-- I'm simply seething with anger and unable to speak. An anger that could have easily been avoided if he'd simply told me that he really likes to have a clean house, think it reflects poorly on him, has guests coming over and wants a cleaner house, thinks its smells, thinks it looks bad, wants it out of the way so he can use the sink, etc.. etc.. etc.

If he'd just explained those reasons to me, even at the ripe old age of 16.. I would have understood. At 16 I'm CERTAINLY capable of understanding why appearances matter, or why he wants them clean so that he can use the sink for other things.

As an adult now, I still react angrily if another adult tries to use BISS on me. Its the assumption that I won't understand whats really wrong, or the fear that I won't accept their reason that drives me nuts. Just FUCKING TELL ME ALREADY!!!

^^ The above all assumes discourse with adults or young adults, so I cannot speak for small children. I can, however, accept that children are unable to understand why they should care about your feelings or your needs as their adult parent; but as soon as I see the gleam in the childs' eye that shows me that they actually CARE about me, then I'll be certain to step away from the BISS reason, and actually explain why its important to me. I think the problem is that some parents never step away, and assume that their children couldn't understand the emotional or rational reason for them needing something to be done.

If you already knew this and he knew you knew this... why should he have to explain himself yet again.

If it's your job to do the dishes. Do the dishes when asked.

I don't disagree that explainations should be forthcoming but you can only explain yourself so much before you start pissing me off...

Perhaps your Dad should have said, "For fuck sakes, son... you know damn well why the dishes need to get done."

By the way, if you are planning on having kids, get used to saying it now...

What if he never explained it in the first place? I think its hasty to assume that the explanation was forthcoming the first time, and not "BISS." It's also selfish to assume as the user of BISS that they still REMEMBER your reason.

Aha! And this is where the resentment, as a child.. came from. It's offered as an authority that I should listen to because I just *should*, but its really not an authority. They chose to bring me into this world, just like they choose to give me shelter and food. It's giving a gift and then demanding recompetence. If I'd felt like my food and shelter were an actual barter deal, and they wouldn't be there if I didn't do my chores, then I could see it. But if you're just giving me food and shelter for free for 10 years and then you suddenly expect me to do your dishes now? Fuck you!

(edit: not fuck you, Charlatan, fuck you.. metaphorical father... in this example...;)

Oh Lord have mercy Jinn, my father would have had you down at the recruiting station and shipped off the military with that attitude...

Of course an explaination should be provided first. BISS shouldn't be used if you are to lazy to provide a reason. However, you really should be capable of remembering why the dishes need to be cleaned.



As we say in my house, this is *our* house and you (my son) are part of the group of people who live in this house. As a member of this house you have certain responsibilities (his are keeping his room and the basement clean, clearing the breakfast and dinner dishes, etc.). I have responsibilities like paying the mortgage and buying the groceries.

If he doesn't want to be a part of our house he can find another house to live in.

Consider the first 10 years a freebie. Now you have to start paying, in sweat (sorry Fame reference... Debbie Allen eat your heart out!).

"Because I Said So" ... Charlatan has said it best. I echo his sentiments...

I think that parents can and should use this defense with their children until such an age as when the children are capable of interpreting a parents reasons WHY they said to do such and such a thing; therefore eliminating the reasons for the parent to just end the conversation at BISS, and allowing them to give justifyable, rational arguments for why Susie must clean her room.

There is no good enough reason why a parent should have to engage in a long drawn out battle with their 5 year old over a messy bedroom. In my experience (one which I hope to carry on with my daughter and future children) when Dad said "clean your room" my automatic response was "okay!", partly out of fear, partly out of respect. I never DARED ask why. That would only ensure the deep pinkish hue of spanked flesh.

my pop threatend me with Military school once....


never went ;)

you know....once when I was younger I asked my mother why I had to do something....she went thru the explanation, to which I listened, told her I didnt agree with her reasoning (sounded good at the time) and waltzed off without doing what I'd been told to do.

Only one more time in my life did I ask why when instructed to do something (seems the 2 month grounding I got didnt really "take" the first time) that time I was told because she said so and grounded for 3 months.

As a mother now, what I dont understand is why cant someone just do what they are asked without having to have a reason for it.

I understand in the military you dont ask your superior office why he gave you an order to do something....why shouldnt a parent have the same respect and consideration?

Shani, if I had gone to military school, they would have sent me home in 2 days. I always ask why. If my question is met with the answer "because I said so" then I don't give a fuck who you are, I'm not doing it. Why is a great question and helps you learn. When I tell someone here to do something sure I'm an asshole about it, but I always say why I want it done that way.

Now, when it comes to kids I take the same stance. I think that if you take the time to explain to you kids why you say to do something it only strenghtens your bond and encourages an openness between the parent and child. That isn't saying you can't discipline them but to just be a dictator only causes rifts between children and parents.

A small child doesn't need an explanation... Does a child need to be told not to touch the stove because it's hot, or not to cross the street without supervision because they could get hit by a car. Because Mommy or Daddy said so should be good enough reason.

When a child gets older and doesn't see a reason to clean their room -- because that's the way Mom and Dad want it, is the reason... The kid doing the questioning is the one causing the rift not the parents.

My mom always tells the story of how she was getting frustrated arguing with one of us, and why couldn't we just do whatever it was... and my dad said "You were the one who wanted to bring them up with opinions."

Heh.

It's a different world. Parents... don't get respect unless they earn it. Frankly, my mom was a nutcase too many times for me to not have argued with her. We once got into a screaming match when I was a teenager because she told me to take the laundry upstairs, and I said I'd do it in a minute. That wasn't good enough, and it devolved from there.
Parents should be the ones in control, but the BISS argument was always bullshit in my house - a method of control, not the healthy kind.

Saying BISS when I'm not 4 is disrespectful to ME. Am I too stupid? You don't care enough about whatever it is to explain? You want me to treat you well, you treat me well too. My parents want me to respect them, they're going to have to respect me too.

ARggh.

Yes a child needs to have an explanation that the stove is hot and can hurt them. Why would that be a bad explanation?? That does nothing but benefit the child. You tell your kids to look both ways before crossing the street so they don't get smashed. Makes perfect sense and helps to reinforce the idea in the child. It would also reinforce the fact that the child will then realize that parent is trying to protect them.

It's all about the age of the child...
How much time have you spent around kids? :D tell a kid that the stove is hot - and betcha a dollar or more that kid is going to touch the stove to see for himself. (heck there'd be a lot of adults who will do the touching)

betcha that same dollar back that if you tell a child "Because I said so" they'll just wait till you aren't looking and still touch the stove :)

and the child will burn himself and mommy will get to say I TOLD YOU SO... if you had listened to me.. you wouldn't be crying. :D

right.. and if you had explained that it was hot.. they would say YOU WERE RIGHT MOMMY ;) which again reinforces the protector image for the child :thumbsup:

Bingo - I was one of those kids. No matter what reason my parents gave for not doing stuff I just had to test it out to see if they were right. 99% of the time - they were. My daughter is one of those kids too.

My daughter also loves to try to draw me into an arguement or giving in at least a little bit. I've said the phrase a few times but most of the time it's been after she's argued every decision I've made that day and I'm tired of reasoning with her. Or when she's continuing to argue a decision that I'm firm on. It seems that sometimes she's just arguing for the sake of arguing and not because she really disbelieves my reasons. When I say "Because I said so." it usually means "I've explained this before (or just a minute ago) and I'm tired of arguing - this is the end of the discussion. You either obey or suffer the consequences."

That's it exactly.

ok.. so say the BISS argument makes them shutup.. at what point does this change from a dictatorship into something more useful to both individuals?

My Mother said Because I said so. The reasoning behind it is if you're mother tells you to clean the house, what more reason do you need. She shouldn't have to clean the house by herself and that was understood. If we had the audacity to ask Why? about something so mundane as cleaning the house or doing dishes we were just idiots.

and who told you that you were idiots for asking why?

I don't know what kind of hippie house you grew up in by our house isn't a democracy when it comes to the kids. My wife and I run an oligarchy where we are the supreme rulers.

I am only partly kidding. I don't see why my three year old should have any real say in how the house is run. However, my 11-year-old son does have some imput. In the end though, what my wife and I decide to do is the way it is going to be.

Children are just that... children. They don't get to make the rules. We do. I will explain myself but if it is something you have been asked to do, you will do it unless you can give me a good enough reason why not.

"Because I don't want to", doesn't cut it.

Nobody told us we were idiots. I just think that I would have been an idiot if I needed to have the benifits of a clean house and clean dishes explained to me.

why is it Charlatan always says what Im gonna say

jesus, its no wonder some kids have no respect for authority.

My firm belief before my son was born and it remains so today is that when children are young you should be as strict as possible (within reason) with them. They need to learn the rules and understand how things work.

This lays the ground work for when they are older. If done correctly, there need only be ground rules. An older teenager should have such an ingrained understanding of what is right and wrong that there should be no need to be strict. They will have self-discipline. They will do what is expected and question what is unreasonable.

So far it is working well with my son. He generally does what is expected of him and has a very healthy skepticism of authority.

As with everything... the key is in the balance of respect for authority without being a sheep.

I hope that's not directed at me. I have no respect for authority because it was slammed down my throat.

Charlatan: I hate hippies and I grew up in a militaristic style house. My dad was in the military for 20+ years. It was "his way or the highway." I bucked against it constantly because I didn't feel it was the right way to do things. Sure a child shouldn't have the say so in matters, that's not what I'm saying. I'm merely saying that if explanations were thrown out there it would encourage a healthy relationship and an open discussion forum between parent and child. If you explain to a child why they shouldn't do things and then they do them, then obviously it's time for punishment. I would like to think that if I hadn't been forced to do things "Because I said so!!", that me and my family would get along better. I'd also like to think that I wouldn't have done have the shit I did. I only did them out of spite to prove I didn't like the militaristic "BISS" style of parenting I was thrown into.

It was directed at anyone who thinks that using BISS after already explaining the same damn thing multiple times is a bad thing.

My house is not a democracy...when I tell my daughter to do something, she needs to do it...end of discussion. I should not have to tell her everyday why she should do her chores when I want them done...one explanation should be enough.

I agree whole heartedly that when it comes to safety issues that explanation is needed, but not every single solitary time.

I think if you look at most of us who actually are parents that have used BISS, we almost uniformly use it in the situation that raeanna describes:
What you are describing is an inflexible form of parenting that few of us would advocate.

I can understand using it when you've already explained something to a child. My whole thought process on this was it shouldn't be used the first time a child is told to do something. I still wouldn't like it after I was already given an explanation but I would have less reason to argue. Perhaps instead of saying "BISS" you could just say "I've already explained why" or "I've already given you the reason" and go from there. "BISS" just sounds so shitty.

Why would it be permissible for a child to argue -- and I'm talking child not hormonal crazed obnoxious teenager -- be allowed to argue with a parent.

it's not permissable.. I just like to argue.

like I said.. if an explanation has been given and the child doesn't ask a reasonable question after that.. then do what you feel is necessary.

Quoted for truth.

I think if you are want to do a good job at parenting, you should help your child learn the "why" of actions, not just that something needs to be done because an authority told them to.

I try to explain the reason for every rule. Sometimes "Because I said so" is the reason. I know we are talking semantics when i reword it, but sometimes rewording is what younger ears need to hear. To me, "Because I said so" often gets translated to "Because that is how I want it done" or very similarly, "Because I decided that is how it is."
This is how it was said to me as a child/adolecent and it worked for me, and seems to work for my stepson.

Sidenote, the head or heads of the house decide how things are, rules subject to change with or without notice, like it or lump it. When I spent some time after University to move home, I had to accept what my father and mother wanted.

To tell how I turned out from it, I am a strong believer in law, I don't back down from adversity, and I am very close to my family.

gucci I really don't think you could have said it any better. I agree completely. There are those of us who believe that authority is earned through merit, and that everything, from power to knowledge, should be questioned. If you've failed to establish your authority by demonstrating you deserve it, then you don't get it. It's always been my fucking body and my mind, and I've will do what I want with it. Establishing that you have authority by showing me that you work 8 hours a day just so that I can enjoy my sucker.. thats legitimate authority. Veiling it in a threat of kicking me out.. that's bullshit.

I'm suddenly understanding why so many people lack critical thinking skills. Their shitty parents indoctrinated them early that asking questions when someone tells you to do something is evil. Yea, well I'll never subscribe to that belief, thank you.

And no, I don't mean to imply that those of you who do use BISS are shitty parents or any of the former, .. and as a matter of fact I think Charlatan's method is the most mature.

However, this thread makes me incredibly angry, espcially "Why should BISS not be a good enough answer?"

To me, we're talking in optimality. What's the BEST parenting method? Not BISS. Sucking at communcation is not a valid reason for BISS -- if you really mean

Then say it. Vagueness never helped anyone.

I have a real problem trying to understand why a parent should earn the right to have authority over their child

Children are people too? I'm absolutely not comfortable relegating children to a sub-human position.

Authority, in its purest form, means giving someone else control over your physical and mental body or ability. I trust that their authority operates in my best interest, and I trust their judgement. I refuse to give anyone control over my physical or mental body without them first demonstrating that they're acting in my best interests, and that they've no secondary motives.

Why should children be second-class citizens?

(I understand that there are some decisions must make for their children, particularly at young age. My interest, however is at the age of 12+ -- why the "BISS" excuse should even be necessary. If your child is 12 and isn't mature enough to understand why you think something should be done without using "BISS," then I think you failed to educate your child at a young age).

There have been many times I have been tempted to use the "Because I said so" road. In such cases it has usually come out like this;

Because I am the parent, you are the child,
I am responsible for you and the way this house-hold runs,
When you are old enough you will move out and have your own house-hold and quite possibly, a family,
That is when you can decide how best to be responsible for yours.

Thankfully I have not had to use this too often, it's pretty much respected. :)

Alright, I suppose I should have given the type of situation I meant.

I understand that by the age of 12, kids should understand why they must do certain things, such as household chores. "Your dad and I shouldn't be the only ones who work to keep the house pleasant" is generally sufficent.

My brother is fifteen and I'm nineteen. The problem is that when we question our parents, they do nothing to answer us. We don't even say "we're not doing this, we're not listening to you" we would (at least I would) just like to know their reasoning behind things.

For instance, last night my mum told my brother that he couldn't go play cards with his friends, even though he'd have a ride there and back. He asked why, and mum said "because I said so."

Or, mum places curfews on me. "Why does it matter if I'm home at 2:00 or 3:00 on a weekend?" "Because I said so."

It's more along those lines. There is no open communication or dialogue regarding our freedoms and responsibilities. That's the real problem.

That's obviously just throwing authority without reason. If one of my kids wants to go somewhere and they have it worked out, I don't argue the plans with BISS. I tell them, "I have no reason why not."
But, I do lean toward my father's doctrine when, as a teen, I said what a lousy democracy our home was: "This isn't a democracy, it's a dictatorship and guess who's in charge?"
All our lives, we will have to do things we don't want to do, but are demanded of us, whether through work, at home, whatever. It seems quite interesting that those who had the hardest time with parental authority as children are also, as adults now, many times have the most difficulty with the authority of work and the demands that just mere living places on them.
This, I think, is more a reflection on how that parental authority was meted out. Extremes either way don't do anyone any good.

Young children do not need a reason to trust and obey their parents. They do it naturally, provided authority is implemented by the parents. I see everyday children who are 2 y.o. never doing what they are told, or parents explaining over and over again the same things: "Don't get close you'll get hurt." etc... At such a young age children should listen to their parents without needing a reason, and parents should not treat their children like they are adults.

Of course, for educationnal purposes, parents should explain, later on when children grow up, why they should do as they are told in such or such particular cases.

If the questionning of the child continues even after the initial explanation, it is only a form of defiance from the child to the parent. "Because I said so!" is only a way of reasserting the parent's authority, and is a very suitable answer...

To me that indicates either lazy parenting or a lack of imagination.

To use BISS in this case shows that your mother can't muster up a reason right now as to why she wants you home or your brother to now go play cards. She simply wants to control your activities and can't be bothered to give a reason.

With a little imagination she could have come up with an excuse that, while not neccessarily being the truth, could have satisfied your desire for an explaination.

In my mind, it comes down to control. She still sees both of you as her babies and can't let go. Emancipate yourself.

You are 19. 19! And while, yes, you are living under their roof, there really needs to be a shift in the power structure. You can (and should) follow her rules BUT, there has to be an acknowledgement that you are now an adult. You need to either negotiate some new rules or more out. Is she still giong to give you a curfew when you are 20? What about when you are 21?

My mother's rules where simple. If I was going to be out past midnight, just call her and let her know. That way she wouldn't be up all night worrying about me. I had this rule from about 17 onwards.

When I moved away for University I was 18. I moved back home that first summer. It was very difficult to submit to living in someone else's house. When I went back to school in the fall, I never moved home again.

Cello,
Yeah, BISS is BS when it comes to an adult still living at home. That I can agree with. Even my mother let me do whatever when I was living at home as an adult. All that she asked was help with the cleaning and that I was actively searching for a job if I wasn't gonna be in school.

So, if you don't follow all of her rules, like a curfew, is she the type of person who would actually kick you out?

Wow, just wow at this thread! So much to say, so much to quote.....


Cello, in your situation, I would agree that BISS is not being used correctly. Your parents need to explain why and not just say no.


This thread is an example of what frustrates me sometimes. To me atleast it was clearly stated in this thread that BISS was only used after the parent had explained themselves multiple times why before using BISS. And that it was wrong to use BISS just because, without explaination. But yet people ignored this and argued that BISS is wrong to use without explaination, which everyone seems to agree on? odd


It is easiler to say BISS is wrong when you never been in the situation yourself. Kids can be annoying just to be annoying.

You wait until you've explained to your 8 yr old that he is too young for a gun 4.2 billion times. After explaining yourself why he is too young for gun for the millionth time, the kid is no longer asking you for an explaination, the kid is asking to annoy you and to hope you'll cave in. BISS is the only reason that kids needs at that time.

With Brett, my 10-year old son, I've had to say this on occasion. I usually attempt an explanation if the situation fits. Sometimes, however, there either isn't time for one, or the reasoning may be beyond their grasp (a two year old doesn't understand most of the finer points of social graces). If I had to abruptly stop Brett from doing something, I'd usually ask "Do you know why I stopped you?" or something to that effect. More than half the time he KNEW what he was doing was wrong (when he was 2 or 3) but that's part of childhood at that age.. .pushing boundaries to see what you can do.

However, I think that "Do as I say, not as I do" and "Because I said so" are perfectly acceptable explanations to kids, and I will use them with my baby when he gets older (at 7 days old, there is no reasoning with them!!!). Frankly, it's a matter of respect. Having a military background, I firmly believe that sometimes the rules are the rules whether you know why or not, whether you like them or not, or even whether they are good or not. *shrug*

All kids have the job of exporing their boundries, and part of that is to rebel against authority, yes, I use to get BISS from my folks and I swore never to use it. Well, I do, but I understand why. Our most recent exchange with my now 12 year old daughter (today is her birthday)

Last Friday Night:

Me: It's 11, you need to get in bed (this is her known weekend bedtime)

Her: Why?

Me: Cause it's your bedtime

Her: Are you guys staying up?

Me: Yes, we're going to watch a movie

Her: Why can't I stay up since you guys are?

Me: BISS, now get in bed...

She KNOWS that its her bedtime, she is just prodding for a weak moment and hoping that we will let her stay up later, she needs no explanation of why she must go to bed at 11, she knows as it's been explained many times in the past (she'll sleep half the day if she goes to bed any later).

As for it just being used, cause the parent is to lazy to come up with a good excuse, that's a crock....

Catdaddy... you have just given a great example of having explained yourself many times in the past and using BISS as a short hand for, "I have explained to you that it is your bedtime, many times. You know you have to get up for school tomorrow and... etc." BISS sums all of that up nicely.

Where BISS would be misued in this case would be if you had never given an explaination in the first place.

Bingo. On a trip to see family once, we bought my kid a blowgun. No, really.

The things are really cool. With a little practice, you can hit an object the size of an orange from across a large room.

The problem arose when he didn't want to let it out of his sight, meaning he wanted to carry it on the plane for our return flight. He was about 11, and he hauled out every negotiating tactic in the book. After a few minutes of discussion, my answer was BISS.

On the other hand, I have observed my wife debate with the kid literally for hours, over something like my kid's desire not to get a shot from the doctor. Whose mind do you think is going to get changed in that scenario?

Throughout my parenting years, I've explained things once, maybe twice, and if it was a black and white decision, the third time was BISS. What was really idiotic was that my wife would argue, reason, or whatever, a situation like the shot, and then come to me and tell me I needed to inform the kid that he WOULD be getting a shot. My response, not that it did any good, was "So why did you waste the last hour debating this?" Then I'd tell the kid, he'd walk off muttering, and he'd go get the shot.

Oh, an example of one thing I do that they probably hate worse than BISS.

Kid: My friend wants to sell me his non-running car for $100.
Me: Bad idea. You don't have the money to fix it.

Kid: But it's a great deal!
Me: No it isn't. You're not doing it.

Kid: Why? (Note: I've already answered that.)

Me: I've already told you. Now you can sit here and argue for the next hour if you want, but the answer is still going to be no. How much time do you plan to keep wasting?

Note to Jinn and Gucci: If you'd behaved in my house as you've related, you would certainly have moved out at the earliest opportunity, because there is no way I'd pay the bills for a kid like either of you. Those eighteen years would certainly seem like a long time, since you wouldn't be able to afford any music, and your only shoes would be saddle oxfords.

He who has the gold makes the rules.

The way most of you explain it, it should be replaced with, "I already explained it." For the rest of situations, all it's going to do is either teach them to resent authoriy, or worse, to blindly obey orders without any consideration of the reasoning. xephrys' question of, "Do you know why ..." is also a much better solution. At the bare minimum, a child should know the logic behind a rule, even if they won't agree with it.

I've also tended to view "my house, my rules" as a pretty lame excuse if not backed up with reasoning, mainly due to my mother's insistence of having three-hour shouting matches with my brother (age 17) every Sunday before dragging him to church with empty threats of an even bigger set of severe consequences each week (I think the worst was the threat of being forced to sleep outside in a hammock in a rainstorm for a few days, with a bar of soap so he could bathe with the hose.*) She still barely accepts the fact that he's an atheist and didn't respond well to years of brainwashing.



* - I suggested this just to see if she would actually say it

BISS closes the conversation as there is no way for a response. If I say that "I've explained it.." that leaves it open for that wonderful "child-memory-lapse-syndrome".. Where she says "explained what?" then I get to repeat what has been said every weekend for the past ___ years....

I don't use BISS a lot, but I do use it for those special situations :thumbsup: