I don't want to be throwing too much out here, but I have been reading, researching and going over everything. I just want to put it out here, can anybody see any relation to the holy spirit as being very similar to the concepts introduced in the thread A philosophical investigation into the nature and role of intelligence in the cosmos http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...t=intelligence

I do not want to upset those of you that have a purely religious faith or belief, I think it is a valid aspect to explore. I can see how this inherent force/will/consciousness can relate to Arts theory of the nature and role of intelligence in the universe. I was just wondering how others perceive this, or if in fact you think I am speculating on concepts that are all wrong?

Thanks..

Who knows?

The only way we know the divine is by our interaction with it. It can't be reproduced in a laboratory and can only be haltingly conveyed to each other through imperfect language.

I know many who feel that "God" is somehow a manifestation or outgrowth of the Universe itself while others, like myself, feel that God must have an extracuricular nature.

But again, who really knows?

I think the biggest danger when talking about such things is believing that we finite, flesh and blood creatures can fully understand the divine while we are on this plane of existance.

The best we can do is to grasp the elephant's leg and proclaim him to be like a great tree.

I agree totally Lebell...

I find it all very interesting and exciting. It is a mystery, the search and the questioning adds so much to my life. It is the reason I stive, question, and look for all the 'higher' ideals in my life.

Ultimately, if we were to ever 'know', it could take away from the experience. I think I have just realised the meaning and beauty of 'faith'. :)

Thankyou...

well simply put.. the holy spirit is your inner voice. that tells you dont do that. the unpardonable sin.. blasphemy against the holy spirit simply means pushing away or willing away the holy spirit.. i.e. you no longer listen to that voice.

the holy spirit fills a person bringing them into attunment with God's commands and instructions.

Since I won't be the first long post in the thread, here goes. The 5th century Pseudo-Athanasian Creed declares (in part):

***

[II] And the Catholic faith is this: That we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity;
Neither confounding the persons nor dividing the substance.
For there is one person of the Father, another of the Son, and another of the Holy Spirit.
But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit is all one, the glory equal, the majesty coeternal.
Such as the Father is, such is the Son, and such is the Holy Spirit.
The Father uncreated, the Son uncreated, and the Holy Spirit uncreated.
The Father incomprehensible, the Son incomprehensible, and the Holy Spirit incomprehensible.
The Father eternal, the Son eternal, and the Holy Spirit eternal.
And yet they are not three eternals but one eternal.
As also there are not three uncreated nor three incomprehensible, but one uncreated and one incomprehensible.
So likewise the Father is almighty, the Son almighty, and the Holy Spirit almighty.
And yet they are not three almighties, but one almighty.
So the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God;
And yet they are not three Gods, but one God.
So likewise the Father is Lord, the Son Lord, and the Holy Spirit Lord;
And yet they are not three Lords but one Lord.
For like as we are compelled by the Christian verity to acknowledge every Person by himself to be God and Lord;
So are we forbidden by the Catholic religion to say; There are three Gods or three Lords.
The Father is made of none, neither created nor begotten.
The Son is of the Father alone; not made nor created, but begotten.
The Holy Spirit is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding.
So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons; one Holy Spirit, not three Holy Spirits.
And in this Trinity none is afore or after another; none is greater or less than another.
But the whole three persons are coeternal, and coequal.
So that in all things, as aforesaid, the Unity in Trinity and the Trinity in Unity is to be worshipped.
He therefore that will be saved must thus think of the Trinity.

Now that you've pondered the above, it is worth noting that the key part of this is the line:

The distinction is between person and substance. One substance, three persons. Before people start sounding off on consistency, both "person" and "substance" have highly technical meanings in philosophy. Specifically, a "person" is an "individual substance of a rational nature." Now please hold all charges of circularity until after I'm done.

A "substance" is something not easily defined, and has many meanings. Substance as contrasted with person can be understood in terms of essence. Basically it is an inquiry into "What is God?"

"Individiual substance" as used in the definition of person has a different meaning, specifically, the idea of assumptibility is excluded, but it is included in "substance" above. When we're talking about persons, we're talking about 'identity' answering the question "Who is God?"

My understanding of the triolgy, for lack of a better term, deals more with perspective. I am a husband, a father, a brother, a son, a mentor, etc. etc. etc. This does not in any way mean that I am several people. I am to those as they perceive me and know me. I think that God is the same way. his physical manifestation on this earth was flesh and known as Emanuel or Jesus. His will, in a non-physical form, is known as the holy spirit.

I hope this helps.