liz phair NOOOOOOOOOOO.....!!!!!!!!!!! - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

dankitti · 05-28-2003, 01:19 PM

there is this thingie inentertainment weekly about liz phair's new makeover, and she hired avril lavigne's producers to make hits for her. um, so much for sitting down and writing artistic songs. says phair:

''People are like, 'Don't be commercial, then. Just be...Wilco.' And that's one way to live. But even when I made ''Guyville,'' I was hating indie then. The whole album was about how much I hated indie. I was sick to f---ing death of that snobbery. You know, I liked radio hits my whole life, including when I was cool. When Shakira goes [sings]'Underneath your clothes...,' that works on me. So here's your question in life: Do you acknowledge who you are even if people don't like you for it? Even if people say, 'That's so lame'? Should I pretend to be cool so that you will approve of me? After I had my kid, the revelation I had was, Life is incredibly short. I like who I am. And I'm just gonna like what I like and go for what I want to go for. It's simple.''

yes you should. um, pretend to be cool so we will approve of you. rather than do generic wallpaper music that people forget in a week. but that's just me.

meanSpleen · 05-28-2003, 02:19 PM

As long as its definitely Liz Phair behind the music, then I'm okay with it. I'm a huge fan of Exile in Guyville, but I wasn't that impressed with her other works (Whitechocolatespaceegg, whip smart).

She really is a great talent, but she needs to enjoy herself. If that means making some cheap music, then so be it. Theres a market for it, and people will enjoy it.

BulletBob · 05-28-2003, 02:38 PM

She has a point. The whole attitude that music suddenly sucks when it sells a couple albums is just fucking stupid. I say good for her, people should do what makes themselves happy.

dankitti · 05-29-2003, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BulletBob
She has a point. The whole attitude that music suddenly sucks when it sells a couple albums is just fucking stupid. I say good for her, people should do what makes themselves happy.

i do NOT have a problem with music that Sells A Couple Albums, or even a couple billion. i am just saying, transforming her own ORIGINAL voice into an imitation of something else is kind of pointless. she may be turning herself into some kind of wannabe after being an accomplished songwriter. the only thing i can do now is actually wait until the music is released and decide for myself.

Troublebot · 05-29-2003, 11:14 AM

Well Dankitti, I'm gonna hold off my judgement on it till I hear it. I liked Exile and picked up Whip Smart and Whitechocolate... as soon as they were out. Good, edgy, different.

So, we'll see. I'm hoping it's an amalgamation of Liz and these pop producers. That should be interesting.

And if she does go completely pop, so be it. She's always made the music she's wanted and if this is what she wants to do, more power to her. Hell, I followed Neil Young through "Trans," I guess I can listen to a pop Liz Phair album.

And can I just say Liz looked really hot in Entertainment Weekly? She's very hot.

BulletBob · 05-29-2003, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dankitti
i do NOT have a problem with music that Sells A Couple Albums, or even a couple billion. i am just saying, transforming her own ORIGINAL voice into an imitation of something else is kind of pointless. she may be turning herself into some kind of wannabe after being an accomplished songwriter. the only thing i can do now is actually wait until the music is released and decide for myself.

From the quote you posted it sounds like her original voice has just been a fake, created to appeal to the indie scene. So who cares if she wants to finally be herself? Isn't that what the whole independent scene is about?

Double D · 05-29-2003, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dankitti
says phair:

After I had my kid, the revelation I had was, Life is incredibly short. I like who I am. And I'm just gonna like what I like and go for what I want to go for. It's simple.''

I have heard a cut off the new LP. It _is_ commercial sounding.
But jeez the woman is older now, and tastes change. It happens to the best of us.

Hal Incandenza · 05-30-2003, 09:13 PM

Brief pointless digression: I grew up near Chicago and spent a lot of time in the city, so naturally I was way too cool to listen to Liz Phair when Guyville came out in '93. Then for some reason I decided to pick up a copy last summer--holy god, it's one of the most jaw-droppingly great albums I've ever heard. If I can find a boot of the Girlysound tapes, I'll be happy...

I wish Phair well with her new material--I haven't heard any of it, but I hope it's good. She's a little off when she equates "indie" and "snobbery," though. The indie philosophy is a thing by itself; snobbery is often a component or correlative of that philosophy, but it's sad and kind of stupid when it is. Indie is (well, should be) a lot more about inclusion, the DIY approach, the rejection of corporate interests, etc. Non-indie musicians can still be worthwhile--White Stripes, anyone?--but I'm generally a lot more interested in what indie bands have to offer than acts signed to major labels. (Insert plenty of exceptions to this rule here: _____ .)

dankitti · 05-31-2003, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hal Incandenza
Brief pointless digression: I grew up near Chicago and spent a lot of time in the city, so naturally I was way too cool to listen to Liz Phair when Guyville came out in '93. Then for some reason I decided to pick up a copy last summer--holy god, it's one of the most jaw-droppingly great albums I've ever heard. If I can find a boot of the Girlysound tapes, I'll be happy...

I wish Phair well with her new material--I haven't heard any of it, but I hope it's good. She's a little off when she equates "indie" and "snobbery," though. The indie philosophy is a thing by itself; snobbery is often a component or correlative of that philosophy, but it's sad and kind of stupid when it is. Indie is (well, should be) a lot more about inclusion, the DIY approach, the rejection of corporate interests, etc. Non-indie musicians can still be worthwhile--White Stripes, anyone?--but I'm generally a lot more interested in what indie bands have to offer than acts signed to major labels. (Insert plenty of exceptions to this rule here: _____ .)

that's pretty much it. i was just reacting to a change in image and liz going from jaw-droppingly great to avril wannabe without hearing any of it first. anyway, FWIW, i do hope it goes well for her. but you DO understand that whenever some artist or band drastically changes their sound or image, it IS inevitable they will lose some of their original fan base. that is all i have to say for now.

Bonesaw · 06-25-2003, 04:31 PM

well I have picked up the new album and have listened to it once through all the way. Some songs more than once. There is definitely the "commercial" feel to some of the songs. You can easily put Avril in as a standby and it would "sound" like Avril. What hasn't changed though is her lyrics. While not all of her songs have the ultimate edgy feel to them, most songs (on all of her albums) definitely have the Liz Phair flair.

At this point the two songs I like the most from her new album are "Rock Me" and "H.W.C".

"Rock Me" because it has the best of being a commercial song but has the edgy-ness that her other albums have.

"H.W.C." is great because who else could get away with singing a song about needing cum as if she would wither up and die without it?

It took me a little while to warm up to whitechoc.... but there came a moment when the song's from that album found their place. It may take a while longer to have the new song's find their place but for me there is still enough of the old to make the new fresh and exciting.

Craven Morehead · 06-25-2003, 07:04 PM

Always have like Liz. As good as her past CDs have been, she hasn't exactly broken through because of them. Maybe this will do it for her. She doesn't have to stay the same forever.

dankitti · 06-26-2003, 06:55 PM

so far, no actual complaints about the new Liz Phair sound. i'm still waiting to actually hear it. um, after my initial overreaction, that is.

Troublebot · 07-23-2003, 08:07 AM

Finally gotten around to listening to it and I think it's what I was hoping for: an analgamation of Liz and the pop producers.

True, it's a little different sound, but it's still our little Lizzy. Haven't heard anything yet that replaces "Stratford-On-Guy as my fave Phair song, but that first cut on the CD is catchy as shit!

Glad I bought it. Good stuff.

wwcd101 · 07-23-2003, 09:18 AM

You can go in a new direction, just make sure you take your fans with you. The new Liz Phair single doesn't do that.

Ouch!

My fav... "I Kissed a Girl"

Thanks for listening.

Donkeypuncher · 07-23-2003, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BulletBob
She has a point. The whole attitude that music suddenly sucks when it sells a couple albums is just fucking stupid. I say good for her, people should do what makes themselves happy.

word.

Bonesaw · 07-23-2003, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Troublebot
that first cut on the CD is catchy as shit!

Glad I bought it. Good stuff.

You are certainly right about that!

rev_skarekroe · 07-24-2003, 09:06 AM

HWC is certainly...interesting...
sk

MikeyChalupa · 07-28-2003, 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by wwcd101
You can go in a new direction, just make sure you take your fans with you. The new Liz Phair single doesn't do that.

Ouch!

My fav... "I Kissed a Girl"

Thanks for listening.

Wasn't "I Kissed a Girl" by Jill Sobule?

-Mikey

wwcd101 · 08-02-2003, 08:02 AM

Ouch!

You are right about "Kissed a Girl". Jill Sobule.

I was trying to remember the song I liked so much off WhiteChocolateSpaceEgg. I just looked it up. It was "Polyester Bride". Sorry for the mixup.

Thanks for listening.

siryn · 08-28-2003, 12:49 AM

Goddammit. For years I was such a dedicated fan. I saw her in concert, was amazed, bought all her cds (even got my hands on the demos, and the out of print ep), and championed the "introduce all people to the magic of liz phair sexiness foundation." For several years I subscribed to the daily email list, where we anticipated this album for sooooo long. Then it comes out, it sucks, and I have lost all hope. Why?! My little brother even called me to congratulate me on how crappy my favorite artist turned out to be. Poop. That about all I have left to say about Liz Phucking Phair.

jimk · 08-28-2003, 05:06 AM

loved exile, hate the single they're playing on the radio in chicago.

05-28-2003, 01:19 PM	#1 (permalink)
dankitti Crazy	liz phair NOOOOOOOOOOO.....!!!!!!!!!!! there is this thingie inentertainment weekly about liz phair's new makeover, and she hired avril lavigne's producers to make hits for her. um, so much for sitting down and writing artistic songs. says phair: ''People are like, 'Don't be commercial, then. Just be...Wilco.' And that's one way to live. But even when I made ''Guyville,'' I was hating indie then. The whole album was about how much I hated indie. I was sick to f---ing death of that snobbery. You know, I liked radio hits my whole life, including when I was cool. When Shakira goes [sings]'Underneath your clothes...,' that works on me. So here's your question in life: Do you acknowledge who you are even if people don't like you for it? Even if people say, 'That's so lame'? Should I pretend to be cool so that you will approve of me? After I had my kid, the revelation I had was, Life is incredibly short. I like who I am. And I'm just gonna like what I like and go for what I want to go for. It's simple.'' yes you should. um, pretend to be cool so we will approve of you. rather than do generic wallpaper music that people forget in a week. but that's just me. __________________ Aw' little girl, there ain't no time To wash yer stinky hand Go 'head 'n' roll over I'm goin' in you again In you again In you again In you again... --Frank appa I Have Been In Yo Last edited by dankitti; 05-28-2003 at 02:30 PM..

05-28-2003, 02:19 PM	#2 (permalink)
meanSpleen Squid hat! Location: A Few Miles Away From Halx	As long as its definitely Liz Phair behind the music, then I'm okay with it. I'm a huge fan of Exile in Guyville, but I wasn't that impressed with her other works (Whitechocolatespaceegg, whip smart). She really is a great talent, but she needs to enjoy herself. If that means making some cheap music, then so be it. Theres a market for it, and people will enjoy it. __________________ Like TFP? Donate To Keep It Alive!!

05-29-2003, 11:14 AM	#5 (permalink)
Troublebot Intently Rocking Location: Davey's	Well Dankitti, I'm gonna hold off my judgement on it till I hear it. I liked Exile and picked up Whip Smart and Whitechocolate... as soon as they were out. Good, edgy, different. So, we'll see. I'm hoping it's an amalgamation of Liz and these pop producers. That should be interesting. And if she does go completely pop, so be it. She's always made the music she's wanted and if this is what she wants to do, more power to her. Hell, I followed Neil Young through "Trans," I guess I can listen to a pop Liz Phair album. And can I just say Liz looked really hot in Entertainment Weekly? She's very hot. __________________ Howard Moon: The wind is my only friend. Wind: [whistling] I hate you.

06-25-2003, 04:31 PM	#10 (permalink)
Bonesaw B3yond! Location: MI	well I have picked up the new album and have listened to it once through all the way. Some songs more than once. There is definitely the "commercial" feel to some of the songs. You can easily put Avril in as a standby and it would "sound" like Avril. What hasn't changed though is her lyrics. While not all of her songs have the ultimate edgy feel to them, most songs (on all of her albums) definitely have the Liz Phair flair. At this point the two songs I like the most from her new album are "Rock Me" and "H.W.C". "Rock Me" because it has the best of being a commercial song but has the edgy-ness that her other albums have. "H.W.C." is great because who else could get away with singing a song about needing cum as if she would wither up and die without it? It took me a little while to warm up to whitechoc.... but there came a moment when the song's from that album found their place. It may take a while longer to have the new song's find their place but for me there is still enough of the old to make the new fresh and exciting. __________________ Q. What is the difference between erotic and kinky? A. Erotic is using a feather... kinky is using the whole chicken.

06-26-2003, 06:55 PM	#12 (permalink)
dankitti Crazy	so far, no actual complaints about the new Liz Phair sound. i'm still waiting to actually hear it. um, after my initial overreaction, that is. __________________ Aw' little girl, there ain't no time To wash yer stinky hand Go 'head 'n' roll over I'm goin' in you again In you again In you again In you again... --Frank appa I Have Been In Yo

05-28-2003, 02:38 PM	#3 (permalink)
BulletBob Psycho Location: Rupp Arena	She has a point. The whole attitude that music suddenly sucks when it sells a couple albums is just fucking stupid. I say good for her, people should do what makes themselves happy.

05-30-2003, 09:13 PM	#8 (permalink)
Hal Incandenza Tilted Location: Enfield MA	Brief pointless digression: I grew up near Chicago and spent a lot of time in the city, so naturally I was way too cool to listen to Liz Phair when Guyville came out in '93. Then for some reason I decided to pick up a copy last summer--holy god, it's one of the most jaw-droppingly great albums I've ever heard. If I can find a boot of the Girlysound tapes, I'll be happy... I wish Phair well with her new material--I haven't heard any of it, but I hope it's good. She's a little off when she equates "indie" and "snobbery," though. The indie philosophy is a thing by itself; snobbery is often a component or correlative of that philosophy, but it's sad and kind of stupid when it is. Indie is (well, should be) a lot more about inclusion, the DIY approach, the rejection of corporate interests, etc. Non-indie musicians can still be worthwhile--White Stripes, anyone?--but I'm generally a lot more interested in what indie bands have to offer than acts signed to major labels. (Insert plenty of exceptions to this rule here: _____ .)

06-25-2003, 07:04 PM	#11 (permalink)
Craven Morehead Custom User Title	Always have like Liz. As good as her past CDs have been, she hasn't exactly broken through because of them. Maybe this will do it for her. She doesn't have to stay the same forever.

07-23-2003, 08:07 AM	#13 (permalink)
Troublebot Intently Rocking Location: Davey's	Finally gotten around to listening to it and I think it's what I was hoping for: an analgamation of Liz and the pop producers. True, it's a little different sound, but it's still our little Lizzy. Haven't heard anything yet that replaces "Stratford-On-Guy as my fave Phair song, but that first cut on the CD is catchy as shit! Glad I bought it. Good stuff. __________________ Howard Moon: The wind is my only friend. Wind: [whistling] I hate you.

07-23-2003, 09:18 AM	#14 (permalink)
wwcd101 Insane	You can go in a new direction, just make sure you take your fans with you. The new Liz Phair single doesn't do that. Ouch! My fav... "I Kissed a Girl" Thanks for listening.

07-24-2003, 09:06 AM	#17 (permalink)
rev_skarekroe Insane Location: Parts Unknown	HWC is certainly...interesting... sk __________________ "If I could have one wish, as in the fairy tales, I would unmake my past, and rise like Lazarus and stand in sunlight and banish all the dark." D. Tibet

08-02-2003, 08:02 AM	#19 (permalink)
wwcd101 Insane	Ouch! You are right about "Kissed a Girl". Jill Sobule. I was trying to remember the song I liked so much off WhiteChocolateSpaceEgg. I just looked it up. It was "Polyester Bride". Sorry for the mixup. Thanks for listening.

08-28-2003, 12:49 AM	#20 (permalink)
siryn Tilted Location: Long Beach CA	Goddammit. For years I was such a dedicated fan. I saw her in concert, was amazed, bought all her cds (even got my hands on the demos, and the out of print ep), and championed the "introduce all people to the magic of liz phair sexiness foundation." For several years I subscribed to the daily email list, where we anticipated this album for sooooo long. Then it comes out, it sucks, and I have lost all hope. Why?! My little brother even called me to congratulate me on how crappy my favorite artist turned out to be. Poop. That about all I have left to say about Liz Phucking Phair.

08-28-2003, 05:06 AM	#21 (permalink)
jimk Addict Location: Chicago	loved exile, hate the single they're playing on the radio in chicago. __________________ raw power is a guaranteed o.d. raw power is a laughin' at you & me -iggy