Radiator Problems
 

My car was overheating about a month ago, so I took it to the dealer and they diagnosed some internal leaks and ended up replacing the radiator and the water pump.

Now, however, I've noticed that the car is overheating again, but only when idling. I presume this is either a problem with the fan or the fan sensor. But I've also noticed something else - when the engine's cold and I remove the radiator cap and start the car, water is gushing out of the radiator. I can't imagine this is a good thing. Shouldn't the radiator be sucking the water in rather than pushing it out?

Does anyone know what this could mean?

I've got a 1997 Camaro, if that helps.

I haven't worked on any recent camaros (97 = recent = ahem) so break out the salt.

Depends on where the return is located. If the return hose is near the cap, water can flow out an opening. I'd leave that for now unless you suspect they reversed the pump flow.

Generally, if the engine is cold, circulation should be confined to the engine via the thermostat valve. If it's really cold and circulating through the radiator I'd be hitting the books. (headscratch)

Overheating while idling is usually an airflow problem. How does the fan shroud look? Broken? Big gap to the fan? Isn't that a mechanical fan? If so they may have used a bad clutch when they replaced the pump, or that may have been part of your original problem.

Also, what's an internal leak? Dealer shorthand for your credit card to their bank account?

Leaking into the engine rather than leaking onto the ground was their explanation.

My 'informal' mechanic said that the water gushing out the radiator was sign of a problem with the head gasket. They wouldn't touch it though, so I doubt they said it just so they could con a hefty repair bill out of me.

If you weren't losing water then they're messing with you. A bad head gasket can blow out water but you'd notice other problems. Leaks go on the ground, in the cylinders (and out the back in steam clouds) or in the oil. (or some combination)

What other problems would I notice with a bad head gasket?

These two statements blare loudly to me DON'T EVER GO BACK TO THAT CON ARTIST SHOP AGAIN!

If they said it was leaking into the enigine, WTF did they replace the waterpump and radiator? Neither one are in ANY way capable of causing an INTERNAL leak into the engine! IMPOSSIBLE! The waterpump on the 97 camaro is mounted on the front of the engine, and is only able to transfer water out of, and then back into the water passages, nothing else. The radiator is connected to the engine via the waterpump inlet, and the thermostat housing, neither of which is able to allow the water to to "internally leak" into the engine. Most likely, you do have a head gasket leak, if there really IS an internal leak, but I would go right to the owner with the reciepts and DEMAND my money back, or Threaten to call the Better Business Buero! They ripped you of TOTALLY!
And by the way, the the 97 Camaro uses electric coolin fans, because of the raking back of the hood. So make sure THOSE are working. Personally overheating when standing still, but not while moving would be more like a fan issue, but I would check to make sure you don't have an internal leak, just to be on the safe side. Check your engine oil, is is white and milky? Does your coolant level get low? or stay the same? Do you have External leaks? Look at all that stuff first.

^^What he said. An "internal leak" is nothing to take lightly. Do a compression check, and see if you have any cylinders out of whack.

^^^What both of them said. It sucks there are still mechanics out there that either lack the knowledge to do their jobs right or just are flat out crooks. Good luck getting it fixed correctly.

as for your overheating problem, check the fan wires. It's not at all unusual for an idiot mechanic to wire it backwards, which sucks hot engine air into the radiator, doing no good whatsoever. It's even more common for them to forget to hook it back up at all.

you could try replacing the thermostat for the overheating, its a pretty cheap and easy fix.

Well, it turns out it was the head gasket and a small electrical problem with the fan. After getting the dealership's outrageous quotation for repairing it, I asked around and found an independent garage that specialises in Camaros. They set to it and called me up at 10:30pm on Thursday night to tell me they'd just finished working on it and that I could pick it up (talk about dedication and commitment!).

Interestingly, before that they had called me and asked me if I wanted them to replace the water pump (which they said was leaking). I declined and said that it had been replaced 3 weeks previously, after which there was a long silence on their end followed by a somewhat sheepish voice saying there was no way on earth my water pump was brand new. I'll be taking that up with the dealership immediately.

What bothers me about the dealership though is that while it seems them initially changing the radiator and water pump wasn't necessary and that the problem was the head gasket all along, it did solve the original overheating problem. Why was that?

Thanks for all the replies guys.