Am I being a "bitch" when I say I'm not a WASP?

[Gilda]

That's what I heard from a colleague today.

This afternoon, I was having lunch in the faculty lounge and another professor referred to me as a "a member of the WASP brigade." I, very reasonably I thought, said that I wasn't a WASP. The person making the original statement said I quite obviously was.

I said, "I think I know my ancestry better than you do," followed by his insistence that there was no need to get uptight about it, but why deny the obvious? Everyone can see that I'm about as WASPy as a person can get.

I said that I'm Ukrainian and Irish, and I'm not a protestant, therefore I am not a WASP.

He said, "There's no need to get bitchy about it."

So wait, you say something stupid, get called on it, get proven wrong, and your response is to call me a bitch? What are you, twelve?

Maybe I'm being a little unreasonable to expect better behavior than this from university faculty, I don't know, but since when did correcting someone's obvious mistake become a reason for hostility? I wonder if he'd react the same way if he called Dr. KGB Chinese and she corrected him, insisting that no, she was obviously Chinese, and correcting his mistake was being an uptight bitch.

It's idiotic stuff like this that makes me avoid the faculty lounge.

Is it being unreasonable or uptight to correct someone who makes an obvious mistake like this? I wasn't offended at the original statement, I just prefer that an accurate label be used, and thought the follow up insistence that he was right and I was wrong about my own religion and ancestry was at best a little strange and at worst obnoxious.

What do you think? Would I be better off just staying quiet in such a situation?

[Zeraph]

What a dumb asshole. Fuck no! Tell him what's what. I would have done the same but in a harsher way (but it wouldn't have seemed harsh, there's a certrain skill/trick to making people look like fools without taking heat for it.)

It sounds to me like he either didn't know what a WASP was, and was very embarassed and covered his embarassment by being angry, or he was playing dominate games with you trying to get you to admit to something you are not and when you showed him he wasn't this badass he thought he was he got revenge by calling you a bitch.

The important thing is not to let this bother you and not be cowed by it.

[Willravel]

WASP =
White Anglo-Saxon Protestant?

If so, then you're fine. You're only part anglo-saxon, and you're not protestant. This guy is clearly a 7 year old girl, and he needs to sit in the corner until he can treat other people with respect. Just because you're a prof doesn't make you a genius. I've had idiot professors, and brilliant professors. Let's face it, we all can't be as smart as Gilda (seriously)!

[Charlatan]

Without hearing how you delivered your reply I cannot say for certain that you were not "bitchy" about it. However, I find it very hard to believe that you could be bitchy.

There is a big difference between being truthful and being bitchy. It sounds like Mr. WASP just couldn't handle that you called him on his faux pas and has a very limited tool bag for offering a reply.

I agree with Will, it sounds like he has the rhetorical skills of a 7-year-old.

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by willravel

WASP =
White Anglo-Saxon Protestant?

If so, then you're fine. You're only part anglo-saxon, and you're not protestant.

That's what it means. So far as I know, I'm not even partly Anglo-Saxon--the Irish are descended primarily from Celts, with a significant influence from the Romans and Vikings.

This guy is clearly a 7 year old girl, and he needs to sit in the corner until he can treat other people with respect. Just because you're a prof doesn't make you a genius. I've had idiot professors, and brilliant professors. Let's face it, we all can't be as smart as Gilda (seriously)!

I wasn't trying to prove anything about our relative intelligence. It was the reaction to the correction that both surprised and irritated me.

[ratbastid]

"Fine. I'm a WASP, and you're a DICK."

[Willravel]

Originally Posted by Gilda

That's what it means. So far as I know, I'm not even partly Anglo-Saxon--the Irish are descended primarily from Celts, with a significant influence from the Romans and Vikings.

Why are you being so bitchy?

Just kidding, of course.

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by Charlatan

Without hearing how you delivered your reply I cannot say for certain that you were not "bitchy" about it. However, I find it very hard to believe that you could be bitchy.

There is a big difference between being truthful and being bitchy. It sounds like Mr. WASP just couldn't handle that you called him on his faux pas and has a very limited tool bag for offering a reply.

I used a friendly tone for the original correction and was neutral with the follow up, despite my irritation.

[ubertuber]

I don't know that I'd say you are being unreasonable in your expectations of university faculty, but in my experience you're being unrealistic.

[Charlatan]

Originally Posted by Gilda

I used a friendly tone for the original correction and was neutral with the follow up, despite my irritation.

I'd expect nothing less...

[aberkok]

Gilda, are you sure you didn't wander into TFPolitics by accident?

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by ubertuber

I don't know that I'd say you are being unreasonable in your expectations of university faculty, but in my experience you're being unrealistic.

How so? I corrected a mistake. Being corrected on a factual matter when you're wrong shouldn't be reason for an adult to get hostile.

Originally Posted by aberkok

Gilda, are you sure you didn't wander into TFPolitics by accident?

Yeah, I'm sure this is the right place. Is there some political component to this that I'm missing?

[ubertuber]

Unrealistic only to think that being educated can prevent someone from being boorish, insensitive, or flat out wrong. Sorry I was unclear about that - I only meant that your hopes were more idealistic than my experience in the world of higher ed.

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by ubertuber

Unrealistic only to think that being educated can prevent someone from being boorish, insensitive, or flat out wrong. Sorry I was unclear about that - I only meant that your hopes were more idealistic than my experience in the world of higher ed.

Ah. You may be right there. I hope this is atypical behavior, but I'll likely be less surprised the next time it happens.

[Ustwo]

Gilda is there something about you that invites this kind of behavior?

I can't recall every post but there seems to be something about you that must scream 'victim'. From getting groped in a comicbook store, to being called a bitch in a faculty lounge, something doesn't add up to 'normal' in peoples reaction to you.

[NCB]

Remember the days when calling someone "my n***a" was an insult and calling someone a WASP was just fine?

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by Ustwo

Gilda is there something about you that invites this kind of behavior?

I can't recall every post but there seems to be something about you that must scream 'victim'. From getting groped in a comicbook store, to being called a bitch in a faculty lounge, something doesn't add up to 'normal' in peoples reaction to you.

I don't know. They could be isolated incidents. I know I give off "timid" vibes because I am, but I'm not sure if that would be reason for others to be aggressive with me. Today I was a bit more assertive than usual and it provoked a somewhat hostile response, so I'm not sure if my timidity had anything to do with it.

Originally Posted by NCB

Remember the days when calling someone "my n***a" was an insult and calling someone a WASP was just fine?

Please note that I didn't take any offense to being called a WASP. I corrected it because it was incorrect, not because there's anything wrong with it.

[Lady Sage]

BITCH= Beautiful Intelligent Totally (in)Charge (of) Herself

In which case I would have responded.... Why yes I am thanks and you would do well to remember it. *Wink*

[Jinn]

I don't know. They could be isolated incidents. I know I give off "timid" vibes because I am, but I'm not sure if that would be reason for others to be aggressive with me. Today I was a bit more assertive than usual and it provoked a somewhat hostile response, so I'm not sure if my timidity had anything to do with it.

If you act timid, people are going to assume you're timid. When you stand up for yourself, you're going to be a bitch.

If you act outgoing, people are going to assume you're outgoing. When you don't stand up for yourself, you're going to be a pushover.

You can't win when you're acting against people's predetermined notions about you. It's best to let them realize that their predetermined notion was incorrect, even if that means they call you names. It was their fault for assuming.

Women first working felt the same thing. She's a bitch, because she's acting against what they assumed she should be doing, which was cooking and cleaning. Rather than be upset that someone incorrectly pre-judged you (or that you've changed) and called you a name, it's better to continue as you were. Soon enough, they'll modify their assumptions until it's okay for you to be a working woman. Or an assertive one, in this case.

[1010011010]

Originally Posted by Lady Sage

BITCH= Beautiful Intelligent Totally (in)Charge (of) Herself

In which case I would have responded.... Why yes I am thanks and you would do well to remember it. *Wink*

I don't think he'd get that you were returning a school-yard level barb as a joke.

[Lady Sage]

Not a joke, a threat.

[Toaster126]

Originally Posted by Lady Sage

BITCH= Beautiful Intelligent Totally (in)Charge (of) Herself

That might be the dumbest thing I've seen today.

As far as the OP, you aren't a WASP, so saying so isn't wrong, per se. Without being there, I can't say for sure you weren't being a bitch about it, but either way, a professional shouldn't be saying anyone is being bitchy about anything in a workplace environment.

[Sultana]

Naw, you weren't being bitchy. It's frustrating when one encounters such stupid, disconnected logic in people who should really know better (read: anyone out of jr. high). Unfortunately, it's often difficult to respond in a way that gracefully points out the level of their immaturity, they are too immature to "get" it. At that point I cease caring what they think about me, and hope only to slip in a witty barb to amuse in innocent standers-by.

[1010011010]

Originally Posted by Lady Sage

Not a joke, a threat.

You could also threaten to give him cooties, while you're at it.

[JustJess]

Originally Posted by 1010011010

You could also threaten to give him cooties, while you're at it.

Originally Posted by Toaster126

That might be the dumbest thing I've seen today.

Okay, okay, what is this, pick on Lady Sage day for trying to be supportive? Sheesh. So it's not the most original comeback ever. Give her a frickin' break, would ya? Sheesh.
/end threadjack

On the OP, I must agree with the overwhelming opinion. That guy=ass hat. You=appropriately assertive. In fact, I think it's a damn good sign of progress for you - you corrected him politely but did not allow him to step on you. If that makes you bitchy, so be it - I'll be a raving lunatic bitch in comparison. Heh.

[The_Jazz]

Thanks for the chuckle, Gilda. I needed it. I've got this image in mind of a middle aged guy in a tweed blazer with elbow patches that quite obviously has a stick up his ass complaining about somone correcting him when he's wrong. It's even better when the thing he's wrong about stereotypically involves branch-rectum insertion.

He was the one being bitchy.

Let me take just a moment to repeat what I tell my employees at least twice a month - 90% of all communication is tone of voice. You can say the exact same sentence in multiple tones and mean multiple things. Case in point - sarcasm doesn't translate into the written form very well.

[Toaster126]

Originally Posted by Toaster126

That might be the dumbest thing I've seen today.

That wasn't very productive. I apologize. What I meant to say was that people who have the attitude that would take being called a bitch as a somehow positive thing are often actual bitches.

That really doesn't sound great either, but hey, the 90% of my meaning that is disarming and good-intentioned isn't coming out.

[Gilda]

Follow up.

I talked to Dr. KGB today. She said I gotten caught in a small bit of inter-department rivalry and differences in regional idiom.

First, many people in the South use "WASP" as a common noun, not as an acronym, meaning roughly "upper class white person". I said I'm not upper class, and she told me that wouldn't have mattered either because thats how a lot of people are going to see me regardless of the truth.

Most also use "anglo" or "Anglo-Saxon" as a synonym for "white," either not knowing or not caring that not all white people are Anglo-Saxons. "Protestant", likewise seems to mean "not Catholic". Essentially, if you're white and don't have an obviously Italian or Irish name, you're a WASP, regardless of what your actual ancestry or religion might be.

This, however, wasn't what the man was saying. The "WASP brigade" is his nickname for the English department, which he seems to think is promoting the values of white, upper-class, intellectual elites.

She said he's been pulling this routine for years and gets bent out of shape every time someone calls him on on one of his Humpty-Dumpty definitions. The confrontation and name calling is his way of testing people and trying to establish territorial dominance. She said that he's not really a bad guy, he just has an abrasive style that takes a while to get used to.

She said not to worry about it; I'm probably the only one who'll remember by next Monday.

[Lady Sage]

Originally Posted by Toaster126

That wasn't very productive. I apologize. What I meant to say was that people who have the attitude that would take being called a bitch as a somehow positive thing are often actual bitches.

Humor usually isnt but it is almost always good for a chuckle.

I get called a bitch on a regular basis, if thats the best they can come up with I simply put it back on them. If that makes me a real one. Yay, go me. I have been called better and worse. Who am I to tell someone their opinion of me is wrong?

PS... Just Jess? Thanks for havin my back.

[Redjake]

I've been known to pull the "WASP" acronym before. If someone acts overly snobbish or yuppie-ish, I usually say "WASP POWER!" or something along those lines. I never do it in front of the person, like the individual did to you. And I only do it in jest. Perhaps they didn't mean for you to take it so seriously or something.

[DaElf]

I bet this WASP guy forgot about this incident the second he walked out of the faculty lounge door. It's impossible to judge the situation accuratley with out tone and body language to go off of. You were proabably being "bitchy" aka angry but were justified to be so I guess....

If someone calls me bitchy I tend to cry into a bowl until it fills with tears. Then with the bowl full of salty emo juice I drown my self.

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by Redjake

I've been known to pull the "WASP" acronym before. If someone acts overly snobbish or yuppie-ish, I usually say "WASP POWER!" or something along those lines. I never do it in front of the person, like the individual did to you. And I only do it in jest. Perhaps they didn't mean for you to take it so seriously or something.

To be clear, I wasn't upset or even irritated initially. I corrected him because he was wrong, much the same way I'd correct him if he'd said I was a blonde. There's nothing wrong with it, it just isn't accurate.

What does race or religion have to do with being snobbish or yuppie-ish? I'm definitely a yuppie, but I'm not sure how that's related to being a WASP or why that would be something to criticize.

[_God_]

Originally Posted by Gilda

What does race or religion have to do with being snobbish or yuppie-ish? I'm definitely a yuppie, but I'm not sure how that's related to being a WASP or why that would be something to criticize.

I'm not either, but if you were black, other blacks would be likely to call you an "oreo."

You see, if you're white, you must, by definition, be racist. And you'd bettter have a sufficient quantity of guilt on board.

If you're black, by definition, you must consider yourself a victim.

Aren't stereotypes great?

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by _God_

I'm not either, but if you were black, other blacks would be likely to call you an "oreo."

You see, if you're white, you must, by definition, be racist. And you'd bettter have a sufficient quantity of guilt on board.

If you're black, by definition, you must consider yourself a victim.

Aren't stereotypes great?

Hmmm. We have several black professors. The younger ones would by definition be yuppies. Dr. KGB is Korean, and she's possibly a yuppie, depending on how far you extend "young".

Grace was once called a "banana", which is pretty amusing because a banana is yellow on the outside and . . . yellow on the inside. It's a pretty strange metaphor if you think about it.

[World's King]

I'm a Vespa...


Italain WASP.

[jorgelito]

[QUOTE=Gilda] Grace was once called a "banana", which is pretty amusing because a banana is yellow on the outside and . . . yellow on the inside. It's a pretty strange metaphor if you think about it.[/QUOTE

Well, for all intents and purposes, the banana is usually considered to have a yellow outside and white inside, hence the pejorative metaphor.

I have never seen a banana with a yellow inside. Brown yes, but yellow, no.

[Gilda]

[QUOTE=jorgelito]

Originally Posted by Gilda

Grace was once called a "banana", which is pretty amusing because a banana is yellow on the outside and . . . yellow on the inside. It's a pretty strange metaphor if you think about it.[/QUOTE

Well, for all intents and purposes, the banana is usually considered to have a yellow outside and white inside, hence the pejorative metaphor.

I have never seen a banana with a yellow inside. Brown yes, but yellow, no.

I get the implication, I just think it's a little strange. Every banana I've ever seen has had pale yellow meat, like this:

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y59...eek/Banana.gif

[jorgelito]

In the same way that an Asian person is not actually yellow (like a banana peel) and a white person is not actually white like snow, the yellow-white descriptors for a banana regarding the peel-meat relationship are generally accepted as yellow-white, not yellow-yellow. The banana metaphor pejorative is just used for convenience sake and not a literal description. Twinkie is another variation. Likewise, coconut (Filipinios, Latino/as) and Oreo (black or African American) are also used in a similar manner to banana and Twinkie.

[slimshaydee]

I would have just played along with it.

[Gilda]

Originally Posted by jorgelito

In the same way that an Asian person is not actually yellow (like a banana peel) and a white person is not actually white like snow, the yellow-white descriptors for a banana regarding the peel-meat relationship are generally accepted as yellow-white, not yellow-yellow. The banana metaphor pejorative is just used for convenience sake and not a literal description. Twinkie is another variation. Likewise, coconut (Filipinios, Latino/as) and Oreo (black or African American) are also used in a similar manner to banana and Twinkie.

I understand the metaphor means "yellow on the outside, white on the inside." I get that. I think it's idiotic to think one's ethnicity should be the primary determiner of how one should behave, but I understand the implication. I just think it's a strange metaphor to use because bananas aren't white on the inside. "Twinkie" makes more sense as a pejorative. I've never heard "coconut".